Can you be blamed for rape vs Can you deserve it, + No Nonsense Self-Defense

When the Eivind Berge media drama was still going on, a journalist interviewed me, and asked me a lot of questions. One question was “Can a woman deserve rape?”.

Here’s the thing – when I read these lists of “rape myths” , there is always a myth being debunked that a woman deserves to be raped if she dresses too sexy and gets drunk. Perhaps the journalist asked me that question, to see if I’d repeat the myth. I answered “Yes, she can deserve rape, if she does something horrible, like torture”. Then she asked if a woman deserves rape if she is drunk and wandering outside. I said no, she doesn’t.

I think we should never mix up “deserved it” with “asking for it”. Those are completely different things. If you talk rudely to some dangerous people, you don’t deserve physical battery, but you are “asking for it”. If you get drunk, pass out and get robbed, you don’t deserve it, but there you go.

Deserving it has to do with your own evil actions. You can say that a murderer, for example, deserves to be killed. They earned it. A torturer deserves torture. A rapist deserves rape. It doesn’t mean we should base our justice system upon this simple “an eye for an eye” rule, as a justice system is not solely about revenge. However, when it comes to deserve, I think I got the right idea. Thus, it’s possible to deserve rape. If it sounds like an unusual conclusion, remember how a lot of people love to wish prison rape on rapists and pedophiles.

“Asking for it” is about how responsibly you’re acting with your own self. It’s not possible to eliminate all risks and opportunities for rape and assault, but it’s possible to make them smaller. It is also possible to increase your risk of being raped or assaulted with your own actions. It’s possible to be partially responsible for your own rape, assault or anything else that could happen to you. I know it sounds callous, but most people already think that way about most things. They just exclude rape.

It’s easier to see how someone might be partially responsible for that bad thing that happened to them, if you imagine they were another person. What they did is essentially make the rape/assault easier for the rapist/assailant through negligence.  It’s reasonable to ask how the reader would feel about a friend who got them drunk and made them go home with a bunch of shady people, or in any other way carelessly put them in a dangerous situation.

But I didn’t write this post to blame victims. I wrote it to clarify my views on the question the journalist asked me. My answer doesn’t tell the reader anything about my real feelings about rape and everyone involved in it. It doesn’t tell the reader whom I actually blame. Blame, like someone wise said, is lame. I don’t care that much about blame.

Here’s the first reason why I don’t care about blame:

“If it were just useless, blame wouldn’t be so bad. But we consider it one of the most damaging and dangerous concepts that has crept into self-defense training and post-incident counseling.

Like a raven raucously screeching with indignation from the safety of the tree branches, it seems you cannot avoid hearing about blame when it comes to self-defense, crime, violence — and most of all — rape.

Unfortunately, while everyone is playing hot potato with the whose fault an incident was, three critical components are overlooked:

1)      People get hurt. 2) Blame is a form of damage control, and no damage control is ever as good as prevention. 3) There is nobody on this planet who is more concerned about your personal safety than you.”

Blame is not gonna help me avoid rape.

Here’s the second reason why I don’t care about blame:

“What’s even worse (having dealt with rapists, abusers, violent criminals and many other brands of low-lifes for many years) we can assure you, you can blame them all you want and they don’t give a damn. In fact, it won’t bother them at all. These people are so self-absorbed that unless they are immediately faced by legal action, physical repercussions or are in some other way inconvenienced, they don’t care how much you hate them. Like water off a duck’s back, the blame and hatred of others has no effect. It will not teach them a lesson, it won’t make them suffer, in fact, they won’t even feel guilty about what they have done. They’re generally too busy blaming others themselves.”

Blame is not gonna punish anyone.

I recommend this self-defense site to everyone, men and women:

No Nonsense Self-defense

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8 Responses to Can you be blamed for rape vs Can you deserve it, + No Nonsense Self-Defense

  1. M3 says:

    “Blame is not gonna help me avoid rape.”

    This is the biggest bone of contention i had with the SlutWalkers in Toronto. Everything they espouse will not help one single woman not get raped.

    – they encourage dressing slutty
    – they yell at men not to rape

    This is a recipe for disaster. Most men don’t rape. The ones that do fit the second quote of “Blame is not gonna punish anyone.” Water off a ducks back, they’ll listen to all the shrieks of slutwalkers, laugh and go rape. SlutWalk actually puts women in more danger by telling them to abdicate their personal responsibility towards their own safety and put it in the hands of the great world god Gaia or something.

    • emmatheemo says:

      I remember we had a rape wave in Oslo last year. They organized a “Take the night back” march against rape, and that weekend, more rape happened. I mean, I understand their anger, they just want women to be able to go home alone without being attacked, which doesn’t sound too unreasonable. But I don’t think it’s helping.
      Then some politician said that men must take some responsibility, talk to their male friends and relatives about this. And that in the end, rape is men’s responsibility, after all they are the ones who rape. I don’t mind the first part so much, but I can imagine a man who never thought about raping would be upset at the idea that he has responsibility, because others of his group rape women.

  2. Eric says:

    M3:
    When we had a ‘slutwalk’ here, the women made sure to march through a section of the city infested with drug-dealers and homeless bums. That shows the types of males to whom they really want to appeal.

    They don’t care about ‘rape’ at all; they just don’t want sex with normal men.

  3. John Tyson says:

    There is an important difference to the robber-analogy.

    No one enjoys being robbed, but many women actual do desire, and sometimes seek out, male dominance, including rape fantasies.

    So a careless person “asking” for a robbery and an adventurous lady “asking” for rape isn’t necessarily the same concept (although there is certainly an overlap).

    For example, I remember having pinned down a girl when I went to primary school, the result of which was that I got a little tribunal scolding me. And I tell you, she was asking for it – in that other meaning. If she wouldn’t have, it wouldn’t have been exciting.

    In reference to you post about “why men rape”, the reasons given there are what I would have thought, but I think there are two “kinds” of rape: Desperate men taking by force what they desire (most entries in your entry), and D/s power-play. I would guess that it’s rather rare that these two actually overlap, because the D/s dynamic does actually necessitate an attraction on the female side – it’s just the she should also be unwilling. See the Roark/Dominique scene: she makes herself expensive prey: Rand called that “engraved invitation”, although I’m pretty sure that no judge would see it that way.

    I would also guess that there are actually a lot more women who desire to be dominated than men who are into dominating women. I believe that because most of the good stories I read about interesting D/s dynamics online seem to be written by women (Rand is just one of many examples of this trend).

    There are a lot of questions how to accommodate this unfortunately biological reality with a legal framework that doesn’t simply result in a lottery for men; Evind has a lot of examples for how it currently is, it’s he who taught me that in Norway being assertive can count as coercion – but obviously it is just fundamentally difficult to tell a D/s dynamic from the case where a no actually meant no.

    • emmatheemo says:

      Haha, it’s a different kind of “asking for it”. My definition in this post was more about “being so stupid getting hurt is almost inevitable”.

      The type of “asking for it” you are talking about.. I heard about it before, here: http://www.angryharry.com/Why-Do-Women-Fantasise-About-Rape.htm

      He says some women do this, and hope the scenario unfolds just like in their fantasy. When it doesn’t, unpleasantness happens. I guess what Roark did was very lucky – he guessed Dominique’s wishes somehow. I wouldn’t recommend any man does this, lol. Maybe Rand wrote is as a fantasy also, but in real life, such a thing might or might not work out well.

      • John Tyson says:

        But there’s a continuum between the Dominique-Roark-scenario and the scenario of a completely shy and passive guy who accepts the first casual “no” to a feeble attempt of conversion and gives up. For example, take an assertive guy that doesn’t take no for an answer and keeps pushing, although he doesn’t get outright violent. Clearly it is difficult to find the “red line” that separates assertiveness from coercion (and the red line differs between cultures and times), even though those things clearly are different.

        Since many ladies like guys to be something between assertive on various levels, there is a legal problem the doesn’t really arise in the case of the burglar.

  4. I had almost 500 000 visitors, and 50 000 facebook likes on a post with photos of a raped child rapist.

    Child rapist raped, stitched by medics, and re-raped by 20 prisoners

    Well, maybe the accusation is false, but that is just a small detail. I am trying to watch the press about this.

    • emmatheemo says:

      Wow, what a story. You can say he deserved it (and eye for an eye, at least if he was proven to have raped/killed the baby), but it doesn’t follow that the state or anyone else should have the right to execute the “eye for an eye” justice. I wonder if people who cheer this aren’t afraid of being fucked in the ass themselves, through a false accusation for example.

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