Potential Reason Why Men Being Attracted to 12 Year Old Girls is Normal

Where does men’s physical attraction to women come from? How did it evolve?

In the ‘sphere, we generally agree that men are programmed to be aroused by signs of fertility. So it would be natural to be attracted to women between puberty/menarche and menopause. And this is an observable fact – men are most attracted to younger women.

A less known fact is the male preference for “years left of fertility”. A 30 year old might be as fertile as a 20 year old, but the 20 year old has 10 more years of fertility left, making her more attractive. This is also an observable fact – no honest normal person would say 10 more years make a woman more beautiful, unless she’s an outlier. If someone says so, they are most likely placating their ego, engaging in self-delusion, or simply don’t want to hurt anyone’s feelings. I haven’t personally seen many women who got hotter at 30, except with the help of makeup or weight loss. I have, however, seen women who did not get worse at 30. Most women I have seen are only slightly less hot at 30.

Having said that, men inexplicably fuck old, post-menopausal women too. You’d think a woman who checks neither of the boxes would be sexless. But it is simply isn’t true in the real world. I guess the fact that women are the gatekeepers of sex is so powerful, it ends up covering the old infertile women also. Men don’t stop wanting sex with their wives after they hit menopause. If it was true, would there be any stories about men complaining “She is done with sex after menopause, what am I to do?..” And if it were true, would 20-something betas go to older single women to gain confidence and experience?

I think I know what draws them in, and it makes evolutionary sense. Older women still have many of the features of a fertile woman – the figure, the voice, the feminine face. It costs a man nothing to give up some sperm to a woman who might still potentially be fertile, right?

That, in term leads me to believe that if it makes sense that old, infertile women are still attractive enough, so are the young girls who are just starting to get the features of a fertile woman. Girls don’t go from curveless children to curvy women at 18 (or 16.. or 14). As someone who’s been all those ages, I know. I know that men will be hitting on you the moment you have something out of the list of features that a fertile woman commonly has. Most of those men will be of the non-law-abiding type, of course. But now I’m convinced that lots, and lots of normal, law-abiding men have “look, but don’t touch” feelings about 11 and 12 year old girls. And it’s not pedophilic at all. Same way being attracted to Helen Mirren’s figure in a red dress is not gerontophilic.

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272 Responses to Potential Reason Why Men Being Attracted to 12 Year Old Girls is Normal

  1. Liz says:

    “Older women still have many of the features of a fertile woman – the figure, the voice, the feminine face. It costs a man nothing to give up some sperm to a woman who might still potentially be fertile, right?”

    Keep in mind the different ages for menopause vary vastly. I knew a woman who went into perimenopause in her twenties, hot flashes and everything. My mom was well into her fifties before she had any symptoms.

    • emmatheemo says:

      Oh yeah, and my granma had menopause in her 60s.. When they artificially induced it to help her survive cervical cancer. Heh, maybe menopause is there for a reason at a certain point (she lived).

    • Trinity Hall says:

      Hi I’m a teenager and think your all sick why the heck would we want to do such gross things with you?!

      12 really I didn’t even start puberty intill 15 and who the heck wants to have kids kecka young you idiots!!

      >:0. Paedophiles and Ephebophilias!!!!

      • I’m a 22 year old man, and I’m agreeing that it’s gross for men to lust after girls so young. But seriously though, I believe that 16 is a good age to marry and have children. I want lots of children, you need to be young to make lots of babies.

      • Isn says:

        Your should be you’re.how can people keep getting that wrong. Fucking idiots you all are.by the way psych docs say is normal to be attracted to tweens as long as you don’t act on it.

      • Sorry, I can only leave a comment by replying to a comment. This article explains that it’s not necessarily evolution that makes men lust after young girls, but culture and society ie the porn industry puts these sick fantasies into peoples minds. I am also studying Sociology and Psychology and also believe this to be the case. Article here – https://goodmenproject.com/featured-content/older-guys-lust-young-women/

      • Sorry, I can only leave a comment by replying to a comment. This article explains that it’s not necessarily evolution that makes men lust after young girls, but culture and society ie the porn industry puts these sick fantasies into peoples minds. I am studying Sociology and Psychology and also believe this to be the case. Article here – https://goodmenproject.com/featured-content/older-guys-lust-young-women/

        Makes me laugh when someone attacks someone for a spelling mistake when they can’t even get their own grammer right!

      • Julianna says:

        um im a 12 year old boy and i just want to know why my friend and i always argue is it normal for her to be this argumentative was it a bad idea to have my only friend at school be a girl thing is she is usually very nice but does it have to do with me being a boy or is natural for women pls answer back

      • Ryan Moody says:

        Theres this thing called free will. You are calling us sick just for thinking. We still have self control to not do those “gross things”. Also if you did not start puberty until 15 there is something wrong with you, must girls start puberty at 10 or 11 or 12. I myself am not attracted to little girls, considering I am 16 myself, I am technically a child myself, I still see the appeal in younger women who have just hit puberty. Its the taboo. People always want to do things we are not supposed to do. Its the innocence. Men are attracted to cute innocence, we are gross I know. Its the physical aspect. Most of my friends and most men I know are more attracted to the petite small body type than the curvy one. Also, lets be honest, the older you get the less attractive you become. I mean, who honestly is more attracted to a 40 year old than a teenager. Thats not guys being creeps, thats just logic. Also, to be blunt the younger you are the tighter you are. I am not an advocate of raping children at all, but its totally fine to have those thoughts. I am sure you have thoughts of wanting someone dead. That is kinda worse than having sex with a minor. But it is fine because you are just imagining doing that, not actually doing that. Do you know how fucked up and kinky most people are. If we acted out everything we thought, we would be disgusting. Over 41% of people in a survey of over 10,000 have admitted to having illegal desires. That doesn’t mean they would actually do those things. Its not illegal to think. Also learn to spell, thanks!

  2. Liz says:

    One other thing…there are a lot of “tell-tale” signs a woman has gone through menopause. It shows in their skin and physique. But today women have access to artificial hormones that can replace the natural ones lost and that too can mask a woman’s biological age.

  3. Eric says:

    Emma:
    Great article. I’ve also believed that women who marry at younger ages reach menopause at later ages. I know my great-grandmother married at 15 to a man twice her age (O the horror! LOL). Her last child was born when she was 46; and may have kept going if I my great-grandfather hadn’t volunteered to go off to the war (at nearly 60) and died from his wounds. There might be something to be said for that too: that having a younger woman also keeps a MAN from prematurely aging!

    • melanie says:

      Don’t you idoits know that girls at 11,12,13,14 are fully physical develop yet to handle a child. GO KILL YOURSELF! People like you should not be a live.

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        If you feel the way you do, Melanie, about this topic, then I hope you’re not voting for Hillary Clinton in the upcoming presidential election. That’s assuming that you’re an American. Just saying.

      • Gordon says:

        Melanie, are you aware that Mary had Jesus when she was between 12-15 years old? And even for non-immaculate conception, this was considered NORMAL in biblical times? I wonder if you really have the moral standing to tell others that they should or should not be allowed to live…

      • Vickie Spann says:

        Don’t get too excited Melanie. There are plenty of mothers and fathers of 11,12,13, 14 year old girls who would “violently” object to a grown man having sex with their children. If you would ask the youngsters, they would tell you, they are not sexually attracted to older men. For some odd reason it is pointed out that women who are older are not as sexually attractive. Surprise, neither are old men. The only reason, children and teens engage in sex with adults, is the need to be taken care of. This was true, even in grandma’s time. A grown man was more able to take care of his 15 year old wife, than a teenage boy would be able to, How many high school age children would be happy to have their perky 30 something mom show up at their events with a dad who looks like their grandfather, or great grandfather? How many would want to take care of old man when they are just starting their own lives after college? Yes, a 20 year old has more years of fertility left (as stated in the article), but many want their children with men who have plenty of life left.

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        In response to your comment >>>> “How many high school age children would be happy to have their perky 30 something mom show up at their events with a dad who looks like their grandfather, or great grandfather?” Celine Dion’s kids didn’t seem to mind. There are a lot more of them than you realize. They just don’t make themselves readily apparent to the general public. Also, Rene Angelil didn’t really look like an old man either despite his significant age difference with Celine Dion. Moreover, he was a better person than Joshua Duggar is. Joshua Duggar’s so-called age-appropriate image ultimately turned out to be a hypocritical facade.

  4. a 12 year old is probably not very fertile, and would be better off waiting a while before getting offspring.

    Usually, girls from better families get pregnant later. For them it pays to wait till their body can take pregnancy with less problems. It is hypothesized that this delay has to do with a watchful father.

    For the male suitors, getting a girl that is a little on the young side is an investment, grooming. He might wait, take it easy, but being a watchful boyfriend, even platonic, he makes sure he is the first one and gets paternal security.

    12 years is about the lowest age of consent there is (if there is one at all).

    I keep saying that age of consent does not mean that it is wise to engage in sex at that age.

    Rather age of consent is the age the state thinks it MUST interfere and MUST mete out sever punishment in all cases, with no exception.

    • emmatheemo says:

      “Rather age of consent is the age the state thinks it MUST interfere and MUST mete out sever punishment in all cases, with no exception.”

      I like that meaning of age of consent.

      Btw, the point of my article is not that it’s good to start having sex at 12 (although many kids do), rather that it’s not strange or perverted to find something attractive about 12 year olds. If 50 year old women can be hot because they “still got it”, then 11 and 12 year olds can be hot too, because they “already got it”. Lol

      • Liz says:

        Age of consent doesn’t just refer to fertility queues.
        NAMBLA, for instance, supports the end of (or vast decrease in) age of consent.

  5. Average Joe says:

    “But now I’m convinced that lots, and lots of normal, law-abiding men have “look, but don’t touch” feelings about 11 and 12 year old girls.”

    It’s definitely not your average man.

    • emmatheemo says:

      Average men don’t generally want to screw old women either, so I’m not saying it’s some major desire there.

      • Average Joe says:

        Old is ugly, true dat.

      • Kat says:

        Young and old women alike generally are not attracted to old men either. I’m fact many older women are opting for younger men. My friend is 14 years older than her boyfriend of 3 years now and he just asked her to marry him. I asked her long ago why she doesn’t date men in her age bracket, she replied “I’m not sexually turned on by older men”.

      • Ryan Moody says:

        I hate how when older women like young men they are called a cougar and a milf, which is hot. But when men like young girls they are perverted sickos, and pedophiles.

    • I don’t know. I think it is definitely a trait of your average man. I know that most men I’ve known in my life (I am a dude) find nothing wrong with finding a 13 year old in a bikini sexy or hot or attractive.

      Now I’ve never known of any of my male friends trying to get with a 13 year old…but to say there isn’t something hot about young petite women with beautiful skin, perky EVERYTHING, etc would just be a lie.

      Now don’t get me wrong, I find older women attractive as well (actually had a fling with a 39 year old when I was 19, go figure) and have no issue with them what so ever. However, a hot, well physically grown out 12-16 year old is definitely possible.

      So yeah, you may not find it OK or find it disturbing or whatever but based on my average it is totally common and purely on mentality and physiology it’s actually a human instinct!

      • andriodvageta says:

        As a 27 year old male who has been with a very wide age range of women I can say that, yes, it is normal for older men to find younger women attractive.

        Every guy I know would tell you that they would TOTALLY have sex with an underage girl if they could. Why? Because they’re hot.

        Look, I think a lot of the people that are all up in arms about this topic are so because they have no EXPERIENCE with being sexually active with girls. No no no…I’m not banging a 13 year old here…I promise. However, what I can say is that I HAVE banged 13 year old’s when it was legal for me to do so.

        What have I learned from this?

        Well for starters, 13 year old girls have awesome EVERYTHING. They have great perky breasts, beautiful flawless skin, nice tight asses…pretty much tight and perky everything. Also, they have GREAT…uhhh…”sexual organs”. Still slightly underdeveloped. Small, fresh, tidy.

        NOW…granted…they aren’t as mature or experienced as older women but let’s face it, it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure out how to ride the D or bend over.

        I say all this to prove my point. I can look at a 13 year old and find her attractive or even sexy NOT because it’s natural (which is part of it and I totally think is a “thing”…it’s evolution, baby!) but because I KNOW what they have to offer me sexually. I know that her vag would feel amazing. I know that you could bounce a cinder block off her breasts.

        It doesn’t help either that I just am naturally attractive to petite women in general.

        So yeah…point of the story is that if you’ve HAD it, there’s NO WAY you wouldn’t still WANT it. I just don’t believe it.

        But in the end I have grown. I’ve seen and done many a thing and have learned how fragile the mind is…especially at a younger age (I do a lot of religious studying and…those poor children…). So therefor, I can say that IF given the chance I probably wouldn’t do it. In the end though I can definitely say that I love to look!

        So yeah, to the author, screw everyone else that’s cursing you right now. They’re inexperienced moral fags that think that a girl magically becomes some super mature grown woman the moment she turns 18. It’s bullshit, clearly. I’ve known plenty of people, both male and female, that are younger and more mature than people I know twice their age.

        I don’t know…kind of ranting now… I will just say that, yes, this article is something I would consider TRUE. Not just through my own experience and opinion but every single guy I’ve ever met.

        Never have a met a dude that said “No I wouldn’t” when asked “If you could have sex with a willing 14 year old and totally get away with it, would you?”.

      • quietdove says:

        Are you seriously trying to say that it’s human instinct for men to be pedophiles and to want to sexually abuse (or even rape) teenage girls? You’re a sick, sick man and I really hope you aren’t acting on those thoughts.

      • Scott Vater says:

        What the fuck are you talking about? Where is there pedophilia or rape in anything that I said? Talk about ME being sick…at least I’ve got reading comprehension and don’t just put words in other peoples mouth.

      • quietdove says:

        Scott, I was replying to andriodvageta, not to you. Sorry for the confusion.

      • Scott Vater says:

        Same person. Different account. Your comment is still inaccurate.

      • quietdove says:

        Whether you like it or not, you are a pedophile if you find young teenage girls attractive. That’s what pedophilia is all about. And you’re also a potential rapist, since teenagers are unable to consent to a sexual relationship with an adult. That’s why the Age of Consent Laws exist, and why statutory rape is a thing. Why are you trying to defend yourself when that’s pointless?

      • Scott Vater says:

        Well if you’re going to call me a pedo you could at least use the right word. Being a pedo is being attracted to pre-pubescent children. Considering that a 13 year old (or older) is NOT pre-pubescent takes them outside of being pedophilia.

        Secondly…no where that I can see do I advocate rape or even consensual sex with a minor. I said something along the lines that “if you could you probably would” but that’s true with a ton of things.

        Either way…I’m no pedo (at all…that’s shit disgusting!) nor do I want to rape teenage girls. I mean, where the hell are you even getting that from?

      • quietdove says:

        How exactly is a 13-year-old girl so different from a prepubescent child? Many 13-year-olds haven’t even gone through puberty yet, so I fail to see a difference there.

        And I said you were a potential rapist. Do you understand what the word “potential” means?

      • Scott Vater says:

        You realize that isn’t true about 13 year olds and that not too long ago it was normal to be married and have kids at that age? Not saying it’s RIGHT to do so now but it’s all natural.

        Also, claiming I’m a potential rapist is just rude and false. I would never, under ANY circumstances, do something to someone else against their will. To say otherwise is extremely offensive. Not to mention the fact that I still fail to see how anything I said insinuates that I would rape someone.

        Again, what’s wrong with you?

      • quietdove says:

        Actually, that is true about 13-year-olds. Different girls start puberty at different ages, which means that some girls do, in fact, start puberty after age 13. Deny it all you want, but that doesn’t make it any less true.

        And yes, oppression used to be a fact of life for young girls, in terms of them being forced to marry grown men. That doesn’t mean that that sort of oppression is natural at all. Tell me, why are you even attempting to justify oppression? (And yes, I know that you said that it’s not right to force girls to marry grown men, but claiming that it’s natural is also a way of trying to justify it.)

        And why should I believe that you’re not a potential rapist? Why should I take you at your word at all when you’re trying to justify all sorts of atrocious behavior?

      • emmatheemo says:

        In western countries, people hit puberty earlier nowadays, so a 13-year old who hasn’t reached it is an exception. Why use this argument at all, if Scott Vater is clearly talking about 13 year olds who obviously went through puberty, and not teens who look like kids?

      • emmatheemo says:

        What a troll. Or a True Believer. Either way, your version of reality is much more extreme than laws in many countries, even feminist progressive ones. And your version of pedophilia is your own, not scientific.

    • mazloomguy2 says:

      Yes it is. the natural age of consent/marriages is 10.

      • andriodvageta says:

        Where? Most girls can’t even have a child or give birth at that age. I would say more realistic would be 12-13. At least give them time to enter puberty, damn man…

      • mazloomguy2 says:

        Really??! Who are you deceiving me or yourself? You must know the age by which all female mammals naturally become pubescent: female heifers, mares and does and all others, ARE adults and fertile at the age of FIVE years. Also in all species the woman grows earlier than the man so by age 10 the woman is larger and more fully developed than the man.

        However humans mature only slightly later most mammals, I don’t know if ur a girl or how many girls you have met, but a woman is fully fertile by age 10. By age 12, a woman has been menstruating. Even the author says age 11, and 10 is a lenient age. That is the natural law and is unalterable.

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        I once did see this one show of “60 Minutes” on television about a 10-year-old girl who had legally married a man in his forties somewhere in the southwestern United States of America. I believe it was in Arizona, and I believe these people were Mormons. They both insisted that they were very much in love with one another. And the husband was not some weirdo like Jack McClellan. This man did sound sincere from his heart whenever he spoke of how he felt about this young girl he had just married. What appeared most unusual to me is that the young girl’s parents had signed the paperwork for her to marry this man. Then again, I’m sure they had a long, long talk with him before they did so. There was a new story so many years later about this same couple when the woman was in her twenties. She smiled and said that many people had thought that their marriage would not have lasted the test of time and that it was even an abomination. However, they were still happily married after all those years. The interesting thing about the interview is that the couple revealed that they had not consummated their marriage until the girl was 16 years old. I guess if the man was willing to wait six years after he married the girl to have sex with her, then he truly must have loved her. Not that I’m taking the high road on this story, but I do think people need to look into all the facts of each situation before they jump the gun and start screaming, “Oh, my God! This is legalized pedophilia!” Because of the sensationalism that sizzles in the press and the media on issues regarding adolescent sexuality nowadays, many people here in the United States of America have lost their ability to be objective about such situations. Everything has become like a knee-jerk reaction whenever Americans attempt to have a civilized conversation about these matters.

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        I once did see this one show of “60 Minutes” on television about a 10-year-old girl who had legally married a man in his forties somewhere in the southwestern United States of America. I believe it was in Arizona, and I believe these people were Mormons. They both insisted that they were very much in love with one another. And the husband was not some weirdo like Jack McClellan. This man did sound sincere from his heart whenever he spoke of how he felt about this young girl he had just married. What appeared most unusual to me is that the young girl’s parents had signed the paperwork for her to marry this man. Then again, I’m sure they had a long, long talk with him before they did so. There was a news story so many years later about this same couple when the woman was in her twenties. She smiled and said that many people had thought that their marriage would not have lasted the test of time and that it was even an abomination. However, they were still happily married after all those years. The interesting thing about the interview is that the couple revealed that they had not consummated their marriage until the girl was 16 years old. I guess if the man was willing to wait six years after he married the girl to have sex with her, then he truly must have loved her. Not that I’m taking the high road on this story, but I do think people need to look into all the facts of each situation before they jump the gun and start screaming, “Oh, my God! This is legalized pedophilia!” Because of the sensationalism that sizzles in the press and the media on issues regarding adolescent sexuality nowadays, many people here in the United States of America have lost their ability to be objective about such situations. Everything has become like a knee-jerk reaction whenever Americans attempt to have a civilized conversation about these matters.

  6. eden says:

    Yes, it makes sense, that men who are not pedophiles may have a sexual impulse toward eleven or twelve year old girls. Their basic intelligence, humanity, empathy also may overpower that sexual impulse, unless they are in fact pedophiles. Or assholes. I think you’re drawing a false equivalency between being attracted to ‘old infertile women’ and pubescent girls. Because one group is made of well, women, and the other group is made of of children. Feelings, even sexual ones don’t exist in a vacuum, we live in communities. So what if it makes sense for Men to recognize the sexual potential of young girls? I really don’t mean to be rude here, but doesn’t the word ‘duh’ apply here?

    • emmatheemo says:

      It’s not a false equivalence, when it comes to pure sexual feelings. I’m NOT talking about anything else here.
      Here’s why it makes sense for EVERYONE to recognize that normal men are capable of seeing something in young girls without being pedophiles: because society views such feelings (even if the man would not act on them) as pedophilic. Because someone has got to say it, and tell the mindless mob of witchunters they are in fact a mindless mob of witchunters. Because in USA, saying you find a 16 year old hot (and you yourself are far older), people go “Ewww, pedophile”. Because fucking idiots will first define pedophile as anyone who likes underage girls “because age of consent is higher”, and apply the same dumb logic to places where the age of consent actually makes this girl legal (f. ex. Sweden: 15). Cuz the American way is the only way, right??

      And that was the point of the article. Sorry if it didn’t come through.

    • emmatheemo says:

      One thing I didn’t notice right away:
      “Their basic intelligence, humanity, empathy also may overpower that sexual impulse, unless they are in fact pedophiles.”
      So attraction to 12 year olds with assets is normal and society recognizes it (as you say in your other comment), but once you act on it, it’s pedophilia (which is attraction to pre-pubescent kids)? Why does your type always insist on calling everything that word? That’s precisely what I was trying to argue against, and you’re providing a nice example of the logical disconnect most of you seem to have.

    • mazloomguy2 says:

      Man is physically no diffent from a cow, horse, deer, or gorilla. Once we remove the veil of our ignorance, hypocrisy and fancy it becomes clear that just as all animals are fertile and adults by age 5, and all females mature earlier than males, an older man having desire for and mating with a 12 year woman is completely right and good from natutal law. And the natural law can never be ‘overpowered’.

  7. eden says:

    I think the truth is that society already recognizes that ‘normal’, or I guess you mean non-predatory men can have some kind of sexual feelings about young girls without automatically being pedophiles. I don’t think men who want to express their sexual attraction to those girls more freely need protecting or advocacy. Agree to disagree.

    • emmatheemo says:

      I heard it countless times from many, many Americans. Stuff like “He likes a 16 year old, he’s a pedo”. Are they just lying or are they brainwashed into thinking liking a 16 year old is “pedo”?

      “I don’t think men who want to express their sexual attraction to those girls more freely need protecting or advocacy.”
      So you’re against freedom of speech, eh?

      • eden says:

        I can’t speak to the motivations of people you have heard express their opinions, but their just opinions, and not particularly incendiary ones. I am definitely not against freedom of speech. Haha, wow. Men have freedom of speech in this country, already, so ‘fighting’ for them to be able to what, more freely talk about their sexual urges? It’s a pointless exercise isn’t it? Anyone who expresses themselves freely, about anything, including their sexual appetites, must also be prepared for others to express themselves freely in response. That’s how this freedom of speech thing works.

      • emmatheemo says:

        “Anyone who expresses themselves freely, about anything, including their sexual appetites, must also be prepared for others to express themselves freely in response. ”

        It’s not what I was talking about. In many western countries you can be arrested if they find drawings of girls who look underage on your computer. You can also be arrested for stories featuring anyone under 18.

  8. eden says:

    So Emma, if a 20 year old man had sex with a 9 year old girl once, thus acting on his feelings, do you think there should be no consequences from society? I think perhaps the laws you’re referencing are more nuanced than you think, or I could be arrested for having a copy of Lolita.

    • eden says:

      Want to add, even if there is sex between an adult and an underaged person doesn’t that doesn’t qualify as Pedophilia, which there is, it can certainly still qualify as harmful to that underage person, it can certainly still be abusive. I’ll grant you, not necessarily in every case, but my opinion that those underage persons are more in need of protection of those adults is never going to change.

      • emmatheemo says:

        If you want to protect underaged persons, you should also take into account that a sex-hostile culture (that includes seeing pedophilia in every gesture) contributes to sexual dysfunctions when kids grow up into adults.

      • emmatheemo says:

        Btw, a sex-hostile culture might also create more of those people who are never going to change (there is a correlation, at least). So I’m not convinced all that policing is helping.

    • emmatheemo says:

      The age of consent (whether it should exist, and if yes, where should the limit go, etc) is a topic for another post.
      All I’m saying here is that your man might not be a pedophile. He might be, but it depends on what his sexual preferences are.

      • eden says:

        I said that my stated opinion, which is that underaged persons who have had sex or may have sex with adults are more in need of protection than the adults who want to have sex with them, is never going to change. I wasn’t talking about people who won’t change. And you didn’t answer my question about what if any consequences you believe there should be for a twenty year old having sex with a nine year old. Gender of either person notwithstanding. As for whether or not it’s reasonable to arrest someone for distributing materials that portray underage people in a sexual manner, my feelings are that it would definitely depend on each specific case. That is not the kind of question I can answer with a blanket statement.

      • emmatheemo says:

        I did answer your question. I said it’s a topic for another post. I don’t pretend to have all the answers, unlike somebody.

    • emmatheemo says:

      The laws are selective with what they attack, sure. It doesn’t change much though. Do you think it’s reasonable to arrest someone for writing a pedohilic porn story or drawing a picture and sharing it?

      • eden says:

        Implying that ‘age of consent’ is too complex for this comment thread is not an answer to the very specific question I posed. I was simply curious about your opinion of that specific situation, and did not expect a treatise on sexual politics. No need to stoop to petty insults. I have no delusions of grandeur about having all the answers to anything in this world. In this case, I know my own mind, that’s all. Have a good night.

      • emmatheemo says:

        I didn’t insult you. It’s true that people with much less education in psychology than me “know” it in their soul that attraction to 16 year olds is pedo, and age of consent needs to be high.

        And you “know” that a man is not a pedo if he finds something attractive in a young girl with boobs (and society totally knows it’s normal to feel that way), but he turns pedo once he acts on it. Your way of debating here and on another site lead to an unfavorable impression. I’m sorry, but you really don’t differ from other people who come here, and constantly move the conversation to something else when I provide a counterargument. I appreciate people who provide interesting points and new info, even if it contradicts my ideas. But when someone with a totally opposing view provides none of these things, yet keeps arguing and arguing, they are wasting my time, and their own. Obviously it can be frustrating and makes me wonder if the person is doing it on purpose. Arguing just to argue. I don’t see the point of doing that on other people’s blogs.
        People can tell me to “agree to disagree” on my blog when that person shows they can provide anything of informative or intellectual value. I have no logical reason to agree to disagree about nonsensical stuff on my own blog.

  9. eden says:

    excuse me, ‘than’ those adults

  10. eden says:

    Alright, I’ll leave your blog. I’d just like to clarify one thing. I don’t believe that an adult who has any sexual feelings about a child ever in their life magically becomes a pedophile by acting on those feelings. I believe that a person who acts on those feelings, male or female, is more likely a pedophile, male or female, than the adult who doesn’t act on those feelings, or at least, more likely to act on those feelings again. Also, what I guess I haven’t articulated here, is that I believe the label of pedophile isn’t the most important thing in this discussion, if a person has sex with a child, and that adult person happens not to be a pedophile, they have still had sex with a child. Sex with a child is a situation with lots and lots and lots of potential for all kinds of harm to that child. A sexual interest in children brings with it a lot of scrutiny, and rightly so, pedophilia or if somehow, not. Thanks for engaging with me.

  11. :-p says:

    “Most women I have seen are only slightly less hot at 30.”

    You are mistaken. 22 is the expiration date. Evolution theory predict that men would prefer 18 year old women over 22 year old women.
    A 22 year old is less perfect than a 17 year old, therefore she cannot be a 10/10 HBB (absolute perfection)
    No honest person would say 4 more years make a woman more beautiful

    ALPHA POWER!
    (flex)

    • TA Junior, drama marquess 2. says:

      In a so-called “study” of penile tumescence, men were found most aroused by pictures of young adult females. That is of course nonsense. In fact, w/o makeup, even women in their early 20s could not hope to compete sexually with girls in their early to mid teens.

  12. infowarrior1 says:

    In many ancient societies. Girls were married off not long after puberty. Joseph for example in the bible married Mary when she is 13. Hence the recent age of consent laws are nothing more than a social construct designed to punish men. For their healthy sexuality.

    • :-p says:

      If you can’t get your Otis Deepthroatis up to anything that’s legal, that’s your own problem, not society’s

    • :-p says:

      You want to go back to ancient times? Unfortunately for you, time travel is not possible

    • Tee says:

      Consent laws aren’t about punishing men. And using the behavior of past civilizations to justify lowering the age of consent isn’t plausible, since the societies were so different, there were many other cultural factors at play that dictated actions. A 13 year old girl from 1412 lived in a culture in which marriage, sex, and birth right after puberty was generally accepted. Try doing that to a modern 13 year old, and it’s completely different. Our modern 13 year olds are not treated as women, but as children, and that’s where the issue arises. Let kids keep their childhood until they’re capable of making fully consensual sexual decisions. And as :-p said, Just because you get hard looking at 12-13 year olds doesn’t mean we should change society’s structure of childhood/adolescence. Would you like your 12 year old daughter having sex with a 30 year old man?

      • infowarrior1 says:

        They are:
        http://m.youtube.com/results?q=barbarossaaaa%20age%20of%20consent%20law&sm=1

        In regards to maturity you are right. We after the 19th century increased the length of childhood to include adolesence. This infantilization however causes alot of harm. I mean don’t you think the teenage angst and rebellion is the result of restrictive infantilization? People at such ages like thomas edition achieved many things. I will include the anecdotal evidence of an israeli friend of mine that had a coming of age at 12-13 and ran a business at such a young age in israel he had the maturity of an adult male yet was not allowed in my country to participate in the synagogue because he is not 18 years of age.

        Why should we have a longer period of childhood then historically speaking? Better to to treat them like adults than teenagers being promiscuous and irresponsible with each other. And personally I would prefer my daughter married to an older more responsible man than riding the cock-carousel. Why should we hold the ridiculous notion that hot and horny teens keep it in their pants for 5 years?

        And guys my personal preferences do not as a rule validate or invalidate my argument. If I were a fat dude talking about the dangers of junk food does not invalidate that junk food is bad.

      • Tee says:

        I never said that teenage shouldn’t have sex or that they don’t have sex. I said that sex with an adult male isn’t right for the teenager, who isn’t mentally mate enough for sex with adult men who may want to exploit there lack of maturity and take advantage of them. Any way you put it, when you want sexy with a 13 year old as an adult, you want to take advantage of them. If not, you would have sex with someone both mentally and sexually mature.

      • infowarrior1 says:

        The probel that you talk about arise because of In the healthy society the father evaluates the potential suitors to the girl. Her immaturity can be supplemented by experienced older women who will mentor her in her wifely role. The sexual relationship I envision is a marriage. How can a man that owes the daughter’s father her due take advantage. Do you think he will tolerate bullshit?

      • copperti says:

        I always understood that because scientifically people did not live as long as we do today, that was why people married so young back in the day.

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        copperti? That logic that you speak of is still in effect today with certain cultures. Take the Irish Travelers for example. The average lifespan of a male Irish Traveler is 39 years old. Their people fear extinction. Therefore, through the generations, it has been a custom for an adult male Irish Traveler to wed a female Irish Traveler as young as 12 years old. They want their girls to have as many children as they can, starting from adolescence, so that their people do not die out. Janet Reno challenged this custom of theirs when she was still the United States Attorney General, but her efforts to do away with it were unsuccessful.

      • melanie says:

        And the fact the 13 year old girls aren’t physical ready to have children.

      • infowarrior1 says:

        Info on teen pregnancy:

        https://consumer.healthday.com/encyclopedia/men-s-health-28/men-s-problems-health-news-469/teen-pregnancy-643940.html

        Given sufficient nutrients, healthy lifestyle and good genetics. A teen can handle pregnancy.

        The problems arise because as it is stated in the studies that are often cited. Those young women are daughters of single mothers of low-socioeconomic status and as those who are fatherless more prone to promiscuity and enter puberty earlier. They give birth out of wedlock and suffer due to poverty poor nutrition and the general unhealthy lifestyle. Add to the fact that their parent’s aren’t really good specimen of humans and you get all of the problem cited in the study as called by “teen pregnancy”.

        There is a big correlation there and while the causal factor is false the correlation do yield information on the extent of promiscuity and the resulting single motherhood.

        However with Fathers even in a society that permits young women under 18 to marry. It will be more uncommon for such pregnancies and pairing to take place than under single motherhood.

    • Tee says:

      You’re talking about gender roles, which I don’t agree with. And secondly, many damaging behaviors, like treatment od daughters like cattle and pedophelia, were accepted centuries ago, but that is no justification for promoting them now.

      And though you say a 12 year old is not a child, she sure as hell ain’t an adult. And as an adult, morally you should have sex with adults, people you are less likely ro take advantage of because you’re mental and social equals.

      • infowarrior1 says:

        Pedophilia is sex with prepubescents. Search it up.

        ” And though you say a 12 year old is not a child, she sure as hell ain’t an adult. And as an adult, morally you should have sex with adults, people you are less likely ro take advantage of because you’re mental and social equals.”

        Makes you assume that a 30 year old man and an 18 year old woman are social and mental equals?

        Don’t you know that culture also has an influence on whether the child is mature or not?

      • Tee says:

        Ha, I know what pedophelia is, and I was not implying that the topic we are discussing is pedophelia either. This is more hebophelia. I mentioned pedophelia as an example of to make to make the point that just because certain behaviors that were accepted in many cultures in the past doesn’t mean they should still be perpetuated in the present. I also used fathers using their daughters as merchandise as another example.

        And you’re missing the point. I’m not saying that turning 18 magically makes someone an adult. The human brain doesn’t fully develop until 25. What I AM saying, is that an 18 year old is ten times more likely to be more mature than a 12 year old more often than not. While an 18 year old and a 30 year old man might not be social and mental equals for a variety of reasons (disability, the man in a position of power over her) under the law the 18 year old is more protected than the 12 year old, who still relies on adults for guidance and has just discovered sexuality. A 12 year old girl is more likely to need protection than a young adult.

        You keep throwing around the words “culture” and “maturity”, but it sounds to me like some petty excuse to lower age consent laws for your own benefit. With the “cultures determine age appropriateness” argument, you can say that a10 year old girl, if she hits puberty is ready for a healthy sexual relationship. If we’re being CULTURAL (-_-)– Since some cultures allow that. How low do you want age consent laws to be lowered before you find it appalling?

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        Tee? You state, “A 12 year old girl is more likely to need protection than a young adult.” In the Irish Traveler culture, the husband plays that role to a 12-year-old girl when she gets married at that young of age. In other words, he assumes the role of legal guardian to her that was previously occupied by her parents. Because the average lifespan for male Irish Travelers is 39 years old, this culture of people depends upon adult men marrying females in their circles as young as 12 years old to prevent their people from going extinct. And actually culture does play a major role in this same issue. Take the American film titled “Hard Candy” and compare to the Italian film titled “Ginger and Cinammon,” and you will see that there is even a diametric difference between what Americans consider to be age-appropriate for the average female adolescent and what non-English-speaking Europeans consider to be age-appropriate in that same respect. I say “non-English-speaking Europeans,” because I consider England to be both geometrically and culturally isolated from the rest of Europe.

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        Tee? You state, “A 12 year old girl is more likely to need protection than a young adult.” In the Irish Traveler culture, the husband plays that role to a 12-year-old girl when she gets married at that young of age. In other words, he assumes the role of legal guardian to her that was previously occupied by her parents. Because the average lifespan for male Irish Travelers is 39 years old, this culture of people depends upon adult men marrying females in their circles as young as 12 years old to prevent their people from going extinct. And actually culture does play a major role in this same issue. Take the American film titled “Hard Candy” and compare it to the Italian film titled “Ginger and Cinammon,” and you will see that there is even a diametric difference between what Americans consider to be age-appropriate for the average female adolescent and what non-English-speaking Europeans consider to be age-appropriate in that same respect. I say “non-English-speaking Europeans,” because I consider England to be both geometrically and culturally isolated from the rest of Europe.

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        I meant to say “Ginger and Cinnamon.” Sorry for the misspelling.

  13. Derfla says:

    You have really reasonable thoughts.

  14. :-O says:

    According to your friend LaidNYC most women in their late twenties are MUCH less attractive than 18-21 year olds.
    Colour me bamboozled.

  15. I am Job says:

    An interesting read. Being a person 28 years of age who is sexually attracted to girls as young as 12 I find myself browsing forums and blogs trying to gauge my sanity. While I would never pursue any of my fantasies, because honestly prison doesn’t sound like a nice place, I do still fantasize. I’m also attracted to women my own age and older and I’ve found that while some of the excitement of the attraction to younger pubescent girls/women/females is the taboo aspect of it, much of it is in fact (at least for me) related to body shape, skin tone, stature as well as some slight perception of increased muliebrity. A lot of men I know and even men I just see in public noticably react to the presence of an attractive young girl, it’s normal so far as I can tell, yet it’s such a charged topic that many people won’t even discuss it. Without the internet I doubt it would even be discussed at all beyond the few people making laws. My stance is that females of that age were supposed to be attractive to me when I was that age, so why now that I have aged should they no longer trigger the same mental and physical responses? The age of consent thing is a complex topic as well, I think as long as both parties are both sexually and mentally mature and willing participants that there should be no problems. I think the biggest problem with the idea of age of consent is that it equates age and knowledge to intelligence and the capacity to make reasonable decisions. I know people my age and older who still can’t make good decisions, maybe we should make it illegal for them to breed as well. While it is true that pedophile has become a blanket term that is used way too often, it isn’t true that one has to act on their urges to be a pedophile or whatever-phile, the correct term for what we’ve been discussing would be hebephile. Say a man gets drunk and rapes a child, is that man a pedophile or is he simply a rapist? That would have to be determined, is he only or primarily attracted to children or is he “normal” in his sexual preferences? It actually does matter, maybe not in the example I’ve used but in the sense of accurately defining things. A man could have a single photo of a pubescent young adult found among photos of women of the age of consent on his PC perhaps and be arrested for sex crimes and be labeled a pedophile, go to prison and get murdered, all because a term is misused. I’ll stop ranting now. I thank you for having the courage to even discuss this topic on your blog, the elephant in this room has on flashing lights and bells but everyone still refuses to look, but they can all smell it I’m sure.

    • emmatheemo says:

      Wow, never expected this comment. Not many men would admit they are attracted to females over a large range of ages, but it shouldn’t be so surprising or seen as perverted. Puberty is, after all, when you transform into a sexually mature animal, and it doesn’t start hitting at 18.

      Me and my friend were 12 when we walked around the city at night (extremely dangerous, but we were stupid), and several times flirty men in cars stopped near us and offered us a ride (we refused and they drove away). I refuse to believe we just luckily stumbled upon 3 sets of pedophiles in one single night.

      Now that you said it, I agree that some of the appeal is due to the forbidden fruit dynamic, but if age of consent was lowered to 13 or 12 tomorrow, I doubt the porn searches for “teens” would go down much.

    • Bubba says:

      Hello I am Job: I read your post and I am also sexually attracted to girls 12 and older, although I would never act on it. I am 37 years of age. I’ve always been attracted to younger girls my entire life even in my teen years. its comforting to hear that it is normal to be attracted and not weird as other people see it. As I see it age is just a number, like you said if both parties are mentally, sexually, and physically mature and both consensual between each other then that should be all that matters, its normal I think for two people to be attracted to each other and love each other. For example a friend of mine that I went to high school with has a 14 year old daughter, I’ve known her daughter since she was 7, her daughter and I have a great relationship together we love each other very much, ( just a friendship nothing sexual) I’ve been attracted to her since she was 12, she is a very beautiful young lady, and yes I do fantasize about her. It feels good to release on how I feel, cause society would never understand, and I don’t think I’m a pedophile. What are your thoughts? Although I will always be attracted to her would it be wrong for me to persue her when she’s 18 which she will be in 3 years? what are your thoughts? As I am 37 my standards have gone up although I am still attracted to girls 12 and older I won’t persue anyone under 18. I have no attraction to women older than me 18 to 35 is my target age range. Is all this normal?

      • Tee says:

        You claim that she’s mentally mature, but yet all that you’ve said makes it seem like you like her for her innocence and it seems predatory. You claim you “love each other very much”. Did it ever occur to you that your sense of “love” and hers are completely different? That while you’re lusting for her, she sees you as a father/authoritative figure. You don’t find that vile and distasteful? As a child her idea of healthy loving relationships is not equal to yours. And everyone knows that the human brain isn’t fully developed until mid-twenties. I personally think that you’re preying on her, even if you don’t think you are.

      • emmatheemo says:

        Yeah, he’s such a predator that he’s only thinking of pursuing her when she’s over 18. How horrible.

        But whatever, I doubt this will work out. You’re likely right and she sees him in a non-sexual light (he spent too long being only friends and he is likely friendzoned). At 17, I thought 35 was ancient. But we’re not stupid at that age. We can tell if someone is unattractive to us, and refuse to have sex or romantic relationships with them. A part of growing up is accepting the fact that other people want other things than the ones we want. Growing up means learning that a lot of adult men will see us in a sexual light. Sometimes it means breaking an old friendship.

      • Tee says:

        @Emma In my opinion, he’s a predator in the sense that he’s had a sexual fantasies about her since she was 12, after having had a personal, fatherlike relationship with her for 5 years since she was a small child. A bit fucking creepy, don’t you think? When someone tells me that they are into girls on the cusp of puberty (or hell just hit puberty), who are still mentally underdeveloped, and IN ADDITION, the girl in question is one he helped raise from early childhood, I am critical. Especially when he asked for opinions, and admitted HIMSELF that he knows what he’s saying is frowned upon by most people.

        And while it’s nice of you to give him ethics points for not pursuing girls who are under 18 physically, I am unconvinced that he is doing this out of some well-placed morality, but rather that he is afraid of the legal repercussions. If there were no 18+ laws, I doubt he would stop at fantasies.

        I know that 12 year old children aren’t stupid, but despite your notion that they’re all out there screwing, many of them are not. Many of them don’t fully understand sex, especially the mental and emotional aspects, even though they might speak about it like they do. And many of them are not able to consent to a relationship with a man who has such a huge age gap/ authoritative gap without there being repercussions. There is a huge authoritative power he yields over her, whether he chooses to acknowledge that or not. Similarly how teacher/teen student relationships are causes for concern.

      • emmatheemo says:

        Tee,

        I don’t believe feelings and thoughts are harmful themselves, and am surprised you seem to think so. Even when someone agrees with you that he should wait until 18, you still think he’s a predator for thinking and feeling what he’s thinking and feeling.

        I do give him points for not pursuing the girl too early, but not because I think sex with a teen under 18 is automatically abuse (I don’t). It was just for the sake of the argument. I also am not conviced by the argument that there is something especially damaging in a relationship/sex between a guy over 30 and a teen. It can be a bad relationship, just like between anyone else, but doesn’t have to be. 18 is just an arbitrary boundary (it’s as far from 25, the age when our brains are fully developed, as 11 is from 18), and people have been marrying earlier than 18 in the past.

        I’m partially speaking from experience, yeah. I wasn’t out there screwing or dating at 12 (and not because old and young men never tried), but many of my friends and relatives were doing it as early as 13 (also with adults). They were the more emotionally healthy ones,too. I simply don’t believe in the myth of teen/adult sex and dating being abuse.

      • Tee says:

        If someone fantasizes about murdering people, but doesn’t act on it, yes, this makes him better than he who actually murders, but it still leaves him as a cause for concern. The normalcy of these thoughts is not ok, and I’m unsure of why you’re not able to grasp the unappealing nature of the situation, despite my explanation of why I deem his fantasies particularly inappropriate, given the nature of his relationship with the girl.

        I am convinced that there is a higher risk of abuse between teen and a man over 30s because of the higher chances of manipulation on the part of of the adult over the inexperienced teen. And while we’re on the topic, I’m not just talking about older men with teenage girls, but older women with teenage boys as well. No relationship has a 100% risk of abuse, but some have higher risks than others.

      • emmatheemo says:

        I don’t find the nature of his fantasies to be unappealing, because I don’t accept your premises. Frankly you seem to be a person of your time and culture, and that can’t be argued around. You are comparing his fantasies to murder fantasies, for Christ’s sake.

        And right, no relationship is risk-free and some might be more risky than others. But the risk needs to be pretty damn high before we illegalize something and impose harsh punishments for transgressing. And I just don’t see the overwhelming harm.

      • emmatheemo says:

        As for Bubba humself, for all I know he could be a bad person. On a legal plane, I’m not for a high age of consent because the law should be pretty clear, not change depending on each case, and not illegalize unnecessary stuff. On a personal plane though, each case is different. If Bubba is actually a bad person and a manipulator, the girl’s mom will hopefully ward off the trouble however she can. And if Bubba is a good guy, and his friend is mature and likes him, I wish them well.

      • Tee says:

        You say, “person of the time and culture” like that’s a bad thing lol. Many of my thoughts are grounded in the present culture, while others are completely different. But based on the responses on this post, I’m gathering that many people who disagree with me would prefer that we live in a more lenient period of time where sex with young adults was acceptable– And I’m not talking about 18 year olds or even 17 year olds, but rather 11 or 12 year olds.

        Regarding Bubba’s fantasies, the question I propose to you is: Do you think it’s alright for a man who has a paternal relationship with a child to desire a sexual relationship with her once she hits puberty? And your comment about the mother “warding” off a manipulator is laughable, only because things don’t work out that way in real life, especially if someone is in an abusive relationship where the manipulation is not discussed or confronted. But I digress.

        And I’m quite the philosopher, and I push hypotheticals to extremes to evoke reactions and motivate thinking about points of view. Hence the murder comment. Not because I believe that murder is the equivalent to the situation aforementioned.

      • emmatheemo says:

        Being a person of your time and place is not optimal no matter what time you are in, because it prevents you from seeing beyond your nose.

        I don’t see anything wrong with the idea of pursuing the girl sexually or romantically after she is 18. I don’t know how these people are personally, and depending on how things really are, Bubba’s idea could be ok, or not ok.

        All I was saying with the manipulator comment is that neither you nor me know these people personally, and whether the relationship would be good or not depends on the details.

        Sorry, I don’t buy your “I’m a philosopher” excuse to poor analogy. Murder fantasies are distinctly different from sex fantasies. If you were trying to evoke a reaction, I don’t get what it was supposed to be.

      • drflra says:

        I don’t think wrongness is the issue here (about your desire to pursue her at 18). It’s really up to you whether or not you can take the brunt of the possible consequences such as her abandoning you because of shock and losing out on a great familial/platonic relationship.

        It’s also about how she feels of course, and it is best if you could find out indirectly whether she actually likes you as a man (Eg: does she overtly present her body to you, like talking super obvious here). I say indirectly so you don’t jeopardize an otherwise worthwhile (maybe lifelong) friend.

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        Bubba? I’m not going to disagree with what Tee said about your scenario. However, I am not going to agree with her either. She is entitled to her opinion just as I am mine. And here is my opinion. I compared your scenario with that of President Grover Cleveland and his wife Frances Folsom, and I find a lot of similarities between both scenarios. Like you, President Cleveland knew Frances Folsom from when she was little. He became more involved in her life than previously when she reached 11 years old because of certain compelling circumstances. Click onto http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frances_Folsom_Cleveland_Preston
        My mother recently read a newspaper article that stated that whenever President Cleveland was asked why he had not yet gotten married at his age when other male peers of his were getting married, he would answer them that he was waiting for his future wife to grow up so that he could marry her. He finally did marry Frances Folsom when he was 49 years old and she was 21 years old, so right there is an age difference of 28 years, which is more of an age difference than between you and that young friend of yours. I don’t know you personally and, yes, I can appreciate the argument that anyone on this blog sheet presents that we live in different times than President Cleveland and his wife did. However, the way I feel is that if it all worked out for the best in the long run for a president of our nation, I don’t see any reason why it couldn’t do so for you. Call me a hopeless romantic and an eternal optimist, but that’s just the way I see it.

      • KaylaBee says:

        As a 16 year old girl, I’d say look in the mirror. When she’s 18, she has a whole selection of younger cuter hotter guys. sorry but no teenage girls wants some nasty 40 year old grandpa with saggy skin and wrinkles lol. no offence but its true, and im just saying. Why would young girls be attracted to YOU, when you arent even attracted to people your age.

      • emmatheemo says:

        You are right, lots of girls don’t want a man that old, but some do. At your age, I thought anything over 20 was ancient. But this: “Why would young girls be attracted to YOU, when you arent even attracted to people your age.” doesn’t follow. Attraction is not about justice. Some teenage girls might be attracted to him, whether he likes women his own age or not.

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        KaylaBee? My last reply to you didn’t post for some reason, so I’m redoing this reply to your posting. Perhaps older men is not your thing, and perhaps they never will be. However, here is some food for thought. Bo Derek was the same age as you when she hooked up with then 40-plus-year-old John Derek back in the 1970s, when she could have had any teenage hunk she wanted. She remained married to him up until his death in 1998. She and John Derek had a happier and more stable marriage than a lot of same-age couples I know of have had. Read about it here on this website.>>>>Click onto http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bo_Derek

        Then, on the other hand, you look at the fact that Macauley Culkin and Rachel Miner were both 17 years old when they got married in 1998. Everyone thought that they looked so cute together and would say, “Awwww. They grew up together. Don’t they make such a cute couple? Like two lovebirds in a nest. High school sweethearts in love.” Well, their marriage ended in disaster after 2 years (legally after 4 years). Macauley Culkin eventually became a train wreck, and since then Rachel Miner has been in mostly Class B movie roles where she either has played a trollop or a deranged individual. It was even rumored that Macauley Culkin had died two years ago, because he was so messed up on drugs. Now when you look at Bo Derek and John Derek, they both have had very prosperous careers in the entertainment industry and they both have lived productive lives. Macauley Culkin and Rachel Miner haven’t. So the point is, KaylaBee, that everyone can’t fall in love with and marry their same-age high school sweetheart like Macauley Culkin did. And who would even want to be Macauley Culkin? His marriage to Rachel Miner represents the crassness and shallowness of many same-age adolescent relationships in the American culture. I mean, at least John Derek seemed like he had more going on in the brains department than Macauley Culkin could ever have in a lifetime, and John Derek had more class than Macauley Culkin could ever have. Macauley Culkin is about as goofy in real life as he was in the movie “Home Alone.” If his aunt, actress Bonnie Bedelia, hadn’t been in show business to open doors for him in the entertainment industry when he was a little kid, his acting career would likely never have seen the light of day.

        Then you take the example of Levi Johnston. After he got former vice-presidential candidate Sarah Palin’s 17-year old daughter, Bristol Palin, pregnant back in 2008 back when he was in high school, he turned into a monstrosity in a short time. He did everything to belittle and humiliate Bristol Palin and her family. He even capitalized on all the scandal he brought to her family, and he owes up to five figures of back child support to Bristol Palin to this very day. It goes to show you that all is not always well for teenagers in the garden of same-age relationships. I would also say that probably it is losers like Levi Johnston and Macauley Culkin in the male adolescent specie who cause girls your age to gravitate away from boys their own age towards older men; girls your age get sick and tired of dealing with all the immaturity and selfishness of adolescent boys. Then the grass starts to look greener on the other side of the age line.

        Another thing that you said that bewilders me is this. You mention about 40-plus-year-old “grandpas” with wrinkles and saggy skin. Where are you running into all these so-called 40-plus-year-old “grandpas” with wrinkles and saggy skin? I don’t think I’ve ever met even one 40-plus-year-old grandpa in my life. Most 40-plus-year-old men I’ve ever known from the time I was a little kid hadn’t been married that long or were just starting a family. If you know of any such 40-plus-year-old man who fits that “grandpa” description, chances are that he is probably some redneck who lives in a trailer and started fathering babies when he was just 14 years old. I mean, I even know of some 40-plus-year-old men who still get carded at the grocery store whenever they purchase wine or other liquor. Actors Brad Pitt and John Stamos are both in their fifties and they don’t fit that “grandpa” description by a long run. Therefore, wherever it is you’re from, people must have an unusually short average life expectancy span.

      • Half way there says:

        I am also a man, 33 years of age, who is very attracted to teenage girls. It’s not ‘about power’, it’s not primarily about innocence or personality. It is totally to do with how they look. They look better, from body shape to youthful skin to radiant hair etc etc.

        The amount of debate that surrounds the topic of ‘what it means for a man to fancy younger girls, is it normal or unnatural?’ makes me sometimes wonder whether evolutionary theory is something only I’ve come across. As soon as you are aware of this theory, there should be minimal doubt in your mind that it’s normal, healthy and natural to be attracted to teenage girls. Given the age at which they become fertile, it all makes perfect sense. Young girls on the brink of fertility would have been far less likely to already be pregnant than a 25 yr old girl. We evolved to fancy them.

        The real question of value is why men purport to not have this attraction- what has society done to them?

        Society thinks it’s weird. So what? There’s a massive disconnect between societal opinion and the truth. That should be a given. Pursuing an 18yr old is wrong to the extent that you value fitting in with societal opinion over your own biological drives. When you learn about the world and realise that societal opinion is to a large extent manufactured by certain powers for their own ends, you lose respect for it.

        The fact that really deserves the most attention in this whole minefield, but one that is always overlooked, is the gargantuan societal crime that is the shaming of men for their natural, healthy drives. It is the definition of sexist for society itself to condemn male sexual characteristics, be it polyamory, or attraction to youth.

  16. bo jangles says:

    Humans used sex for social cohesion in primitive times. The fact that women hid when they are fertile helps show that it had a purpose other than reproduction as well as how long the act takes, compared to other animals(hiding fertility is extremely rare in the animal kingdom where breeding times are veryyy obvious). I suspect indigenous people had sex early and often as it was a skill comparable to hunting (ever notice how much more into a guy you get if hes good in bed? Or how much more into a you a guy is if you’re good in bed?) I don’t think being good at sex (other than being successful at insemination) is a quality any other animal genetically selects for.

    • emmatheemo says:

      You know, I remember reading something like that about monkeys – young monkeys who didn’t “play” early were bad at sex and monkeys that did were functioning well. Gotta find this paper though.

      • St_Julian says:

        I just happened on this forum and read lots of the posts. I’m a retired policeman, and have seen the aftermath of too many pedo interactions with children. I suppose it’s natural for grown men or women to think a kid of the same of opposite sex is very attractive and have thoughts along those lines. Here’s the thing: thoughts will soon enough become actions, and those kinds of fantasies are THOUGHTS ON STEROIDS!! It is far better for grown men to get their “Otis Deepthroatis” up to only the legal stuff, because no matter how much some of these guys say they are “lookee no touchee,” most of them are LIARS, plain and simple. Whenever we caught some old fart trying to meet up with young girls they had fooled on the internet, they ALL said the same thing: “Well, I really wasn’t gonna’ do anything with her, I just wanted to hang out and talk.” Yeah, right, Some of them had driven as much as 5 hours and showed up with alcohol and condoms, just to hang out and talk to 12, 13, and 14 year old girls. So 95% any of these guys who claim they just like looking at 12 and 13 year old “hotties,” but would never act on their feelings and fantasies, are straight up liars.

      • Scott Vater says:

        I think a lot of this is that “if you could steal and KNOW you could get away with it you would” type things. This is the reason we have laws and punishment. Most people I think would do devious acts every once in a while if they knew they wouldn’t get in trouble. I don’t think that it makes someone a bad person though. Would I have sex with someone underage if I KNEW I could get away with it? Meh, who knows, really. Would I like to? Eh, I like the idea of it. Not for any super perv-y or disturbing reason (as I know many would), mind you, but just because they’re young and attractive.

        It seems to me that you are of the mindset that someone who would do this or admit to it is some immediate scumbag. You have to keep in mind that there are different levels for everything. The murderer that wants to kill every single person on the planet because they’re a fucking psychopath is a TAD different from the jealous and temporarily deranged mind of the husband that just killed the man his wife was having an affair with after walking in on them. The two are a little different on the “mudering” scale, no? Sure they both did (or would want to) something bad but one is a little more tame and understanding.

        If given the chance would I have sex with a 15 year old? Again, who knows. I certainly wouldn’t want a virgin one (wouldn’t dare take that innocence) nor do I REALLY think I could…but I might. Again, not for some messed up reason but simply because who wouldn’t want a young and perky woman? Kind of in line with the article/blog post though. I think it’s pretty natural to be attracted to young women. Just because I think it’s natural doesn’t mean that I need to or would want to stalk young girls and be all creepy about it. Certainly not to the point of driving 5 hours and coming with alcohol and condoms (though in all honesty I wouldn’t be talking to underage girls to begin with).

        So yeah…different levels to the stuff man. Especially when it comes to sexual wants…which are nearly always a bit darker and more disturbing then normal every day things. I don’t ever judge based on what someone WANTS but more or less what they DO.

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        Do yourself a favor, Scott. If you get the chance to see the 1971 science-fiction film titled “THX 1138” starring Robert Duvall, do so! After reading your post, I can almost be sure that you’ll find that such a film accurately portrays what the United States of America has been reduced to as a result of its Draconian age of consent laws. Furthermore, even if you don’t agree with me in that regard after seeing that film, you’ll still likely find the acting in it to be quite superb. You could probably even pull up the whole movie on YouTube. If you get to see it, enjoy!

      • emmatheemo says:

        After seeing St_Julian connect pedophilia with men who go for girls in their early teens, your comment is appreciated. Although I’m not sure I want to connect murder and sex with teens. Murder is still murder and involves someone being harmed, even if there are degrees of it. And consensual sex is just sex. It doesn’t imply harm automatically.

      • Scott Vater says:

        Well, the connection to murder, in the United States anyways, probably isn’t THAT far off. Considering atheists are looked at as being less trust worthy than rapists, a 27 year old having sex with a 13 year old might as well be murder…especially considering the legal implications. You can literally murder someone in this country and serve not only less time but not be a registered sex offender for the rest of your life.

        In fact, given the choice, I think I’d rather commit murder and face the consequences then have sex with someone half my age and know that my life is ruined forever.

        “Murder is still murder and involves someone being harmed, even if there are degrees of it. And consensual sex is just sex. It doesn’t imply harm automatically.”

        This is why I think age of consent laws are put into play and why I think, in the end, they’re a good thing. If it was legal to bang 12 year olds then innocence would be gone as every other man in this country would be trying too. Now, I DO think that, in some cases, the punishment is too severe. I know of a story of a 21 year old having sex with a 17 year old and had to serve like 8 years in prison AND be a registered sex offender for the rest of their lives. That…is bullshit. So yeah…age of consent laws are OK…but the punishments should be way less severe (depending on age differences, how old the youngest is, etc).

        Plus consensual is a big deal as well. Just because that 12 year old is agreeable about having sex with someone twice her age doesn’t MEAN she SHOULD…or even that it’s OK. Every woman I’ve met that started having sex or being a slut at that age did nothing but turn to drugs and became more of a whore that ends up spitting out kids by unknown fathers that just leech off of society…etc etc. Now that’s not to say that it WILL happen to all but the chances of it I would think are pretty high.

        In fact, they ARE pretty high. My mom who is in NA (narcotics anonymous in case you don’t know) has said that a good 95% of the female addicts that she’s met were sexually abused as kids or started having sex at a young age and, because of dealing with general scum at that age, turned to drugs as a result. So yeah, there is a pretty direct correlation come to think about it.

        So in the end I guess I’m a pretty big moral fag about this. Like I’ve said…would I bang a young teenage girl? Man…I’d certainly like to due to how good I know it would feel and because I like the petite and innocent look in women…but WOULD I if given the chance? No…hell no. Why? Just because I don’t want to be a reason as to why she’s growing up fucked in the head. Legal implications are a pretty big deal too which, again, is I why I feel they should be there as they act as a deterrent at the very least.

        Now, as I think I’ve covered in the past here, I don’t like the views that “St_Julian” have. I do feel that he/she feel WAY too strongly and one sided about this. That or I’m just part of that %5 that can look at a 13 year old and think, “Shes hot!” and not ACTUALLY want to bang her.

        Anyways…ramble ramble ramble….

      • emmatheemo says:

        You can be a “moral fag” as you call it, but I’m not sure you have to. Your conclusion that early sex harms people doesn’t seem well-supported to me. Granted, I don’t know the whole picture myself, but you are looking at a correlation, not a causation. And if you are from USA, you live in a certain culture, where they are hellbent on convincing everyone that early sex will lead to ruining your life, and abstinence is the only way to go. People have been having early sex and marrying early for a very long time, and since we managed to produce civilization, I have a hard time believing that early sex intrinsically makes someone more likely to be fucked up in the head.

        Heck, Norwegians start having sex slightly earlier than Americans, and there is certainly less crime, not more. And our age of consent is lower. Not to mention, age of consent does not stop 12 year olds from fucking each other.

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        Emma? You’re from Norway? That’s cool. That would explain a lot of things. Scandinavians have a worldwide reputation of being more open-minded about subjects like the one being discussed on this blog sheet. I once saw a television special that revealed that Norway even houses male and female convicts in the same correctional facilities, because Norway doesn’t have a problem with prison sexual violence like the United States of America does. I often find myself asking other Americans why my country clings on to futile and even harmful customs and domestic policies until it becomes undeniably obvious that they no longer work nor benefit society. I hear that there is little or no income inequality in your country and other Scandinavian countries. On the other hand, homelessness is everywhere here in my country. I think the United States of America could learn a thing or two from the Scandinavian countries.

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        But here’s what doesn’t make any sense about our age of consent laws in our country, St_Julian. Many other countries have ages of consent as low as 13 or 14 years old (e.g. Argentina, Spain, Austria, Germany, etc.) Other societies are very open-minded about adolescent girls having significantly older boyfriends. The United States of America has taken this “Pedophile Panic,” so to speak, to great extremes not only by raising the ages of consent in most states to 18 years old but also by putting extraterritorial laws on the books that criminalize adult American citizens who have sexual relations with teenagers younger than 18 years old abroad. These other countries don’t outlaw such actions of these same adult Americans traveling abroad. In fact, their societies condone it. Parents in those other countries do not only permit their teenage daughters to hook up with older men, but they also even encourage it in many of these same countries. Therefore, what do we as Americans get out of these extraterritorial laws other than overloaded court dockets and out-of-control prison populations? (*Note – I don’t like how Americans use the word “pedophile” so loosely and indiscriminately, because it misleadingly implies that all adult men who have either had extra-platonic interests or have acted on them with adolescent girls are wired inside their heads the same dangerous way as adult men who rape and murder prepubescent little girls, such as Jesse Timmendequas and Joseph Duncan III.)

        I’m not mindless of the fact that international human rights activists want to protect small children under 11 years old from sexual exploitation that takes place in brothels and human trafficking rings all over the world. And, yes, even some adolescent girls in these really poor countries are forced into undesirable situations they don’t want to be in. However, if a 21-year old American man happens to meet a 14-year old German girl at a social event over in Munich, Germany where the age of consent is 14 years old and they start a relationship together that results in intimacy, what is the point of putting that young man through the humiliation of a frivolous and malicious statutory rape trial in Federal court upon his reentry into the United States of America? And how does it help our deteriorating economy to fly that 14-year old German girl and other witnesses here to the United States of America and put them up in costly hotel rooms at the expense of American taxpayers to testify in such a trial just for the sake of some moral crusade that self-righteous do-gooders proclaiming themselves to be child advocates have embarked upon? The reason that 21-year old American man is probably with a 14-year old German girl is because he didn’t get to experience the pleasure of having his first adolescent love when he was an adolescent himself, and his inexperience in the area of relationships has likely caused him to feel as though he has crossed over into an alien zone whenever he attempts to relate to women his own age. Whether we wish to admit it or not, our American society is one of the most stratified ones in the entire world where the haves get everything early in life and the have-nots get left behind at the mercy of their own devices. We cannot deny as Americans that many of the age of consent laws across our nation have been molded after this same unjust casting system.

        Moreover, as I try to view it from your standpoint, if these “old farts” that you describe in your post were overseas hooking up with 12, 13, or 14-year old girls in some country like Bolivia where society, the law, and even these girls’ parents are completely okay with these men’s actions, wouldn’t that sit better with Americans who don’t want these men engaging in this sort of behavior in our own country? Then at least parents of teenage girls here in our own country would just see it as some other country’s problem, even though that other country may not even view it as a problem in any way, shape or form.

        If we can’t abolish these extraterritorial laws that export “18 years old” as the age of consent to other countries for Americans traveling abroad altogether, we should at least give the men who get arrested for breaking them the option to renounce their American citizenship and leave the United States of America for good instead of sending them to Federal prison for 20 years. Forget about arguments over patriotism. It would be more beneficial to the American economy and everybody would come out of this situation with at least some satisfaction. It’s as though our country buries itself in so many of these Puritanical sex laws that we ultimately do more damage than good to our society at large. There also exists a whole different world that thinks more freely beyond the barbed wires of our so-called land of milk and honey, and many Americans refuse to acknowledge that it even exists in fear that they may feel compelled to explore ways of thinking and living other than their own.

        We have ghettos throughout our country where clusters of individuals who have been convicted of non-violent sex offenses involving minors are usually living homeless, because they can’t live anywhere near where kids congregate and they have an impossible time finding employment. Middle Eastern terrorist organizations are aware of these people, and they could zero in on this problem at any time by recruiting these people as mercenaries and arming them with guns and ammunition to wage war on our nation from within our borders. These men convicted of such offenses living in these ghettos have so very little to lose and probably wouldn’t think twice about taking these terrorists up on their offers. Our system has treated these men crappy enough to cause them to become disgruntled with our public officials; and Middle Eastern terrorists don’t care what these men have been convicted of, because Middle Eastern terrorists are forcibly taking little girls as young as 8 years old into their harems of brides and mistresses and violating them. Yeah, our government could arm our military and our police with more weapons and ammunition than it already has in order to prepare for such a scary ordeal, but do we really want to go down that road? Defense spending by our Federal government is already way too bloated. Also, our country is becoming enough of a Fascist totalitarian police state as it is with the way basic civil liberties and rights are always being taken away from us every day. Jesse Ventura even made a comment about this fact in a TV interview. When I was a little boy, I never saw police officers on television dressed in military attire and driving tanks like you may have seen on television after the bombing at the Boston Marathon a few years back. Too many people in our society are seeing this issue with tunnel vision rather than looking at the whole broad picture from a bird’s eye view. As I said in one of my other posts on this blog page, it’s very difficult to separate the politics from this issue. In fact, you cannot separate the politics from this issue. I respect your opinion, but I just wanted to give you a little food for thought.

      • emmatheemo says:

        Great comment. The high age of consent is like a hammer to cops – makes every “forbidden” relationship look like a nail (in non-metaphorical terms, it makes it look like abuse).

      • Scott Vater says:

        See to me he’s getting a tad creepy with it though. Like, why, other than sex, would or COULD you even have a relationship with a 12 or 13 year old? There’s nothing in common there, they’re kind of boring because of their knowledge, etc. Just a couple years ago I dated a 17 year old (9 years younger than me) and we literally had like NOTHING to talk about. I mean, she was cool and had a good personality but we just had nothing in common really.

        I don’t know…his argument certainly isn’t valid but he is taking it to pretty extreme extremes. Lower the age of consent down to like 16 or something…but 12 years old or younger? No…at that point it’s less about artificial morals and more about actual psychological development morals.

        In other words…just because you don’t see anything wrong with having sex with someone ~12 years old doesn’t mean that there ISN’T anything wrong with it. I think wayyy too many people here think wayyy too much about how THEY feel about it and not how the other party involved feels about it. That’s a BIGGG problem in my eyes. I mean, why not just go a head and get rid of age of consent laws all together?! Fuck it, right??? Who cares how the little girls of boys feel about it! They’ll turn out OK!

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        Scott? I don’t know whether you’re commenting about my post or about St_Julian’s post when you use the word “creepy.” If you’re commenting about my post, I take no offense to it. I don’t know you, and you don’t know me. Therefore, we cannot possibly know all the reasons why I see this issue from one standpoint and you may see it from another. If we had to sit on a jury together and hear one of these carnal knowledge trials involving an adolescent girl, I’m sure you’ll at least agree with me that you and I would likely have some really interesting conversations with one another during deliberations. I know that you and I both question St_Julian’s opinion on this matter, so I know that we see eye to eye on that much concerning this subject matter. In any event, allow me the opportunity to validate my argument further.

        The question on whether or not if it is okay for an adult man, no matter how young, to have a sexual relationship with a 12-year old girl is not one that can be answered YES or NO. It’s a Catch-22 question like asking someone whether or not they believe in extraterrestrials. For example, if you answer that you don’t believe in extraterrestrials, then you’ll sound like a hotheaded skeptic who denies the possibility of intelligent life out there in the universe despite the odds favoring that it likely exists. However, if you tell people that you do believe in extraterrestrials, then you worry that people will start to think you’re a head case. Well, the same rule applies to the question on whether or not it is okay for an adult man (even an 18 or 19-year old man) to have a sexual relationship with a 12-year old girl. If you say it isn’t so, then you’re denying the fact that girls have married that young in the past to men significantly older than them and have lived happily ever after. If you say it is so, then you sound like some looney tune with a hidden agenda that involves the sexual exploitation of young people.

        Anyhow, here is my take on the matter. I never said anything about doing away with the age of consent in our country altogether. I once read an article online that indicated that there were at least four countries in the world that had no age of consent, and those countries were not places that you would want to vacation. I believe Pakistan is one of them. It relies on its religion to establish what sexual activity is right or wrong. That place has become a cesspool of violence and human rights violations against women and children in recent years. In any event, I really don’t think that there is a one-size-fits-all formula to address this subject matter of whether or not relationships between adult men and adolescent girls should be completely decriminalized and/or condoned by society. I’m being civil with you in my response, because I find it admirable that you at least admit that you have looked at girls as young as 13 years old with extra-platonic interest; and I don’t think there is absolutely anything wrong with you choosing to be a law-abiding citizen with regard to the age of consent laws either. We all have to bear the consequences of our choices no matter how warranted we feel those choices are. Therefore, it never hurts to make the safest choice, even though I am a strong believer in civil disobedience.

        Nevertheless, back in 2002, there was this one female author named Dr. Judith Levine here in the United States of America who published a book titled “Harmful to Minors; the Perils of Protecting Children from Sex”. This book delved into the same subject matter that is now being discussed on this blog sheet. I never had the opportunity to read this book in its entirety short of a few excerpts from it here and there. However, I know that this book stirred up a storm of controversy between liberals and conservative-minded, self-proclaimed child advocates. I, however, did get the opportunity to see this woman interviewed on television, and she said some very interesting things about this subject matter. One of the points that she brought up was the fact that the Netherlands had an age of consent of 21 years old up until the year 1990. This law caused many problems for the public at large in that country, and the Dutch Parliament ultimately decided that this age of consent was way too high. In fact, it was the highest there was in the European Union at the time. In any event, the Dutch Parliament decided to lower their country’s age of consent to 16 years old in 1990. Also, they added a provision to their age of consent of 16 years old that would grant 12, 13, 14, and 15-year old youngsters the right to contest a charge of carnal knowledge or statutory rape against their older significant other. The Dutch Parliament accomplished this law by creating a government agency called the Council For The Protection Of Children that was empowered to force a judge to vacate a criminal case of carnal knowledge or “statutory rape” from his/her docket whenever this agency decided that the ends of justice would not be served in trying someone in a court of law who may have crossed the legal age line without the intention to harm anyone. The Dutch Parliament saw that there were prosecutors and judges who didn’t care about anything else other than to get their retirement, and they felt that it was time that their country had a sort of gatekeeper to prevent public officials in both their criminal justice system and court system from becoming too inebriated with power whenever these kinds of cases came before them. Supposedly there have been modifications made to this same law in Holland since 2002. I don’t know what those modifications were, because I haven’t had the opportunity or occasion to research it recently. In any event, Dr. Judith Levine voiced her opinion during a television interview that this type of set-up should be brought to the United States of America. I know you don’t believe that the age of consent should be any lower than 16 years old in any state throughout our country. However, the fact of reality stands that there is a major difference between adolescent girls of 12-15 years old who deal with real life problems and little girls who are still in elementary school and still have their baby teeth.

        Don’t you at least agree that the age of consent laws throughout our country should at least provide for exceptions in certain cases when the alleged “victim” is between 12 and 15 years old? I can fully understand why a violation of the age of consent law is considered a strict liability crime when we’re talking about a 5, 6, or 7-year old victim. Little girls that age shouldn’t be having sexual intercourse with teenage boys in high school or middle school or with anyone. Therefore, if an adult man makes sexual advances at a little girl that young, he is clearly a child predator. However, 12, 13, 14, and 15-year old girls no longer live in the innocent world of Barbie dolls, Saturday morning cartoons, and Santa Claus. Many of them have to deal with highly adult situations and problems. If we’re going to set the age of consent at 16 years old or higher, I would think that it would only be fair that a prosecutor would have the burden of proving that an alleged “victim” between 12 and 15 years old suffered some kind of physical, emotional, or psychological harm so that he/she would be more reluctant to pursue frivolous types of carnal knowledge cases in court that will benefit nobody. Just giving the prosecutor the full advantage of simply proving that the accused perpetrator was over the age of majority and the alleged “victim” was below the age of consent somehow just doesn’t sit well with me, and I can be sure that it likely doesn’t sit well with a lot of Americans. Such a situation should not be treated as one cold equation under the eyes of the law in the American criminal justice system, and the problem is that it is.

        I can appreciate your argument that when there is a significant age difference, a young man in his twenties or early thirties is not likely going to have very much in common with a 12 or 13-year old girl in our American culture. However, when you look at the celebrity world and see how such so-called forbidden relationships have shown significant success, I would still think that you would at least acknowledge that there have been and there still are exceptions to such a so-called rule. Look at the example of Melanie Griffith and Don Johnson. When Melanie Griffith first moved in with Don Johnson and started a romantic relationship with him back in 1972, she was still in her early teens and he was well into his twenties. Click onto http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melanie_Griffith. Country singer Loretta Lynn married at age 13 to her 20-something year old husband Oliver Lynn back in the 1950s. I could give you example after example in this respect, but here is my point. What may be right for one person may not be right for another person. As I said before, there is no one-size-fits-all formula or solution to these situations.

        I can see that you take a firmly moderate position on this subject matter, and I’m not bashing you for doing so. However, try to keep an open mind to the opinions of others who may not see everything completely from your standpoint. Don’t get me wrong, Scott. I have known of relationships between adult men and adolescent girls to be disasters. When I was 11 years old, my sister (then 16 years old) was friends with a pregnant 15-year old girl who was shacking up with the 29-year old father of that same 15-year old girl’s unborn baby. The man was a train wreck if I ever knew one. My mother screamed at my sister for bringing me with her over to this man’s house when I was still 11 years old one time. I later discovered that this man hopped from bed to bed with girls as young as 12 years old. My mother and I always suspected that he had friends in high places, because he never seemed to get arrested for his activities with young girls. However, on the other hand, I’ve known of young adult men to do the noble thing and marry an adolescent girl with whom he became serious, and these men still get unfairly burned by the criminal justice system. It appalls me whenever I hear stories about women in their forties and even fifties with significantly older husbands whom they married when they were 13 or 14 years old, getting a knock at their front door from a police officer who has a warrant for their husband’s arrest on charges of “statutory rape” or carnal knowledge simply because someone suspected that these women had sex with their husbands right before they married them and these women just happened to live in some blue funky state of our country that places no statute of limitations on violations of its age of consent laws. By the way, I live in one of those blue funky states. As I said in my previous posts, basic freedoms are disappearing one by one in our nation. Do see “THX 1138” starring Robert Duvall when you get the chance. I think you’ll like it. It’ll give you a good idea of what I’m saying about what’s happening to the United States of America.

  17. I have to agree with you. I do think these following points are correct as I as a male thinks:

    ‘A less known fact is the male preference for “years left of fertility”. A 30 year old might be as fertile as a 20 year old, but the 20 year old has 10 more years of fertility left, making her more attractive.’

    ‘I guess the fact that women are the gatekeepers of sex is so powerful, it ends up covering the old infertile women also. Men don’t stop wanting sex with their wives after they hit menopause.’

    It was a really well thought out post and what you write is sane compared to irrational Feminists come up with! 😀

  18. sam covins says:

    How does an innocent, pre-pubescent, non-attractive girl (child) automatically become an available, sexy, woman one magical day after she has been 17 for 364 days? Is this not maddening? The truth of the matter is: nothing is attractive about an overweight, cellulite ridden, saggy body. We are sorry but this is not attractive!!

  19. This article is very interesting and touching on something very taboo for modern feminized society.

    Men will have sex with animals if it’s all that’s available to them. More men are rapped in the US than women if you count prison rapes. This means that men have sex out of desperation which isn’t necessarily their ideal. Women don’t rape each other in prison in high numbers like men do. Men have stronger sex drives. Given the choice, I doubt men would have sex females below 9 and older than 12. The traits that women get after about age 12 aren’t attractive and that’s why women remove these traits. (leg hair, pubic hair, nipple hair, armpit hair,) Women also hide large adult pores with cover-up, and paint on larger pubescent eyes with eyeliner.

    src: http://egomoral.com/child-bride-denial/

    • emmatheemo says:

      You know, that’s weird, but you’re onto something. SOME traits women get after 12 are not seen as good. The body hair, and pores. Actually, I wouldn’t say the hair counts, as it appears a lot earlier than 12. I don’t know entirely why hair is so bad in our culture (it wasn’t always like this, and isn’t like that across the globe), but I suspect it’s just another way women compete with each other by making themselves as different from men as possible. Kind of like “Body hair is natural, but men have more of it, so lets seem more female by removing ours”. It’s just my guess. It sure makes sense, if you also look at other things women do – keep long head hair and wear makeup that increases contrast in their faces (just look at this pic and see why contrast is increasing femininity: https://www.google.no/search?q=contrast+face+feminine&newwindow=1&client=firefox-a&hs=wsE&rls=org.mozilla:nb-NO:official&channel=sb&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=d7dvU9DBCYroywOir4HQAg&ved=0CAgQ_AUoAQ&biw=1366&bih=657#facrc=_&imgdii=_&imgrc=BBUt5VXgL_tS6M%253A%3BS5r_32yVFhrPyM%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252F1.bp.blogspot.com%252F-5odrBoJLnWI%252FUq7Co8uaeQI%252FAAAAAAAAB88%252FQCPClmJJYts%252Fs1600%252Fcontrast.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.alexlovessweden.com%252F2013%252F12%252Fa-post-about-makeup.html%3B400%3B198 ). They say men prefer long hair on a woman because it signals many years of good health. But this is a genderless reason that can apply to men, yet only on women is short hair seen as less hot. Is it another sign many female beauty traits are about differentiating themselves from men as maximally as possible?

      However, not all changes happening in the early teens are bad. Bigger boobs is one thing. I would also say the face gets more distinctly feminine during the rest of the teen years, but I dunno if you’d agree. So I wouldn’t agree with your assertion that men would prefer 9-12 girls best.

    • Tafatle says:

      ” Given the choice, I doubt men would have sex females below 9 and older than 12.”
      Speak for yourself, please!

    • macint00 says:

      These posts are disgusting. A 12 year old is a CHILD not an adult. Some of you people are talking about being with children as young as 10 and sorry but that makes you a pedophile. I have nieces that are 9, 10, and 13. Only the 13 year old is currently going through puberty but she still looks like a little girl. I have a little girl and frankly you people scare the shit out of me. I get men making comments about her already and it makes me sick. Stop sexualizing children and date grown women. If you are in your 40’s and want to date a 20 year old, fine knock yourself out. But talking about having intercourse with extremely young adolescents like 10-14 range is wrong. I saw one guy posting about how he would like to have sex with an 13 year old because her vagina is slightly underdeveloped. I guess it doesn’t matter if you injure that child because she is not developed enough. That is sick. Obviously there is something wrong with you. And don’t give me that crap about how you like petite girls there are still plenty of small women if that is your thing. And talking about how how unattractive older women are is messed up too. I doubt you are all walking around with six pack abs and wrinkle-free skin. Stop trying to justify your perversions and seek help. The reason you all want super young girls is because they are naive and you can take advantage of them. Let children BE children. My rant is not for the 40 something man who likes 25 year olds..it is towards the perverts who want to have sex with children. And YES gentlemen 11,12,13 year olds are children.

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        Well, macintoo. Every “Fox News Channel” has an Alan Colmes, and every “MSNBC” channel has a Steve Schmidt. So I guess it’s only fair that everyone on this blog sheet gives you your fair say in this discussion despite that you disagree with the majority here. However, allow me to correct you on one of the things you said in your post. You stated that you saw one of the men on this blog sheet state “how he would like to have sex with an 13 year old because her vagina is slightly underdeveloped.” You complained that you guessed that “it doesn’t matter if [he] injure[s] that child because she is not developed enough. That is sick.” Well, if it means anything to you, that man was describing a sexual experience he had with a girl that age when he was 13 years old himself. Not to say that teenage boys don’t do horrendous things to girls that young; they do. However, when men over 21 years old actually treat girls this age more decently than teenage boys do, it doesn’t say very much positive about these teenage boys or the parents who raised them. Nor does it say very much positive about society at large for assuming that an adolescent girl will be guaranteed to have a storybook romance if she hooks up with a boy her own age whereas if she dates someone a little older than what may be viewed as conventional, she is doomed to a life of sexual exploitation and abuse. However, I find that people who hold your reactionary perspective on this issue appear to view same-age relationships among adolescents to be a safe haven for adolescent girls 12 years old and older to grow romantically and sexually. However, that is not always the case. There are teenage boys as young as 13 and 14 years old who cannot even be trusted with adult women.>>>>Click onto http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=d79_1183880276
        There are teenage boys who cannot even be trusted around toddlers.>>>Click onto http://www.dreamindemon.com/2015/06/17/cody-feran-baum-accused-stomping-girlfriends-2yearold-daughter-death/#disqus_thread
        Therefore, whenever you hear about a teenage girl marrying a man significantly older than her, why does society always have to bash him? At least such a man has done the honorable thing. Furthermore, the heart does what it wants rather than what society expects it to do.

        Also, the man who posted the above cited comment you objected to was also not in his forties but rather in his twenties, if that means anything to you. Quite frankly, I’ve never met a man in his forties who had facial wrinkles as you describe, so I’m curious as to what part of the world you live in. It certainly cannot be the United States of America or Canada. Anyhow, since you brought up the subject of 40-plus-year-old men pursuing adolescent girls, let me just say this. Every rule has its exceptions, even the ones written in stone.>>>>Click onto http://www.al.com/specialreport/mobileregister/index.ssf?childbride9.html
        Women go down this same road too, you know.>>>>Click onto http://www.al.com/specialreport/mobileregister/index.ssf?childbride8.html
        It doesn’t necessarily make them pedophiles or child predators.

        As for your aggressive use of the word “pedophile,” I think that the way people have defined this same word has become overly politicized and arbitrary in this day and age. Here is a word that sat on the medical books for nearly a hundred years without a specific word-for-word definition to describe exactly what it was. When an actual word-for-word definition for this word was finally printed in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM) in 1980, 13 years old was established as the cutoff point as being too old to be the object of a pedophile’s depraved desires. In recent years, there has been a dispute over whether to lower the cutoff point to 11 years old.>>>>Click onto https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pedophilia
        On the other hand, Dr. James Cantor got dollar signs in his eyes when he attempted to raise this cutoff point to 14 years old a couple of years ago in his plea to the American Psychiatric Association to redefine it in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM) in accordance to his wishes. Of course, this is the same charlatan who believes that left-handed people, who are half the world’s population, are more likely to be pedophiles than right-handed people; and he believes that pedophiles generally have low IQ’s, which law-enforcement officials could easily disprove in view of all the difficulties they have catching these people whenever they victimize children. The word “pedophile” comes from the Greek language, and the Greeks don’t even use the same alphabet as English-speaking people do. Therefore, it is no mystery why even the experts cannot agree on the specific definition of this word here in the English-speaking world.

        In a lot of ways I am no different than you are, and I don’t deny that there are adult men who do unspeakable things to adolescent girls as young as 12 years old. If it makes you feel any better, I didn’t shed a tear when Ariel Castro committed suicide in prison. I also saw Phillip Garrido as the face of evil. Also, when I read this one article online, it nearly brought tears to my eyes.>>>>Click onto http://www.jillstanek.com/2013/02/raped-impregnated-13-year-old-keeps-baby/
        However, I also recognize that there are two sides to this issue just like any other controversial issue. Child advocates rant and rave how there is no difference between a 6-year-old girl who is sexually molested by an elderly predator on the playground and a sexually active 14-year-old girl who passes her 20-year-old boyfriend off as a 15-year-old boy so that her parents won’t press statutory rape charges against him. However, nothing could be further from the truth. Yes, if I were to see a man grabbing a 6-year-old girl into his car in front of a grocery store and attempting to kidnap her, I would try to stop him from doing so. However, if I were to meet someone who told me that her mother was 14 years old and her father was 26 years old when they got married, I would never call that individual a rape baby nor would I go accusing her parents’ marriage of being a form of legalized pedophilia. It just would be very disrespectful to do so. As a matter of fact, I did meet a woman so many years ago who fitted that description. She would have fought anyone tooth and nail to defend her parents’ honor.

        I know you think that the world would be a better place if we lived an age-appropriate Utopia, so to speak, where everyone kept to their own generation in their romantic pursuits, especially whenever adolescents were involved, but that just isn’t reality. The Duggars of “19 Kids And Counting” promoted that same doctrine for years. Jim Bob Duggar would brag to the world on television how he was 15 years old when he met his wife Michelle, who was then 14 years old and how they got married right out of high school; and he’d push this ideology on the world as being how it should be for everyone. However, recently the fact came out that these people were a bunch of hypocrites in the form of the oldest son Josh Duggar who got married to his same-age sweetheart at age 20 and always preached about how perfectly marriage and starting a family needs to be timed. This man molested a 5-year-old girl when he was in high school. He’s addicted to Internet porn. He had two different accounts with Ashley Madison so that he could cheat on his wife, and here his mother (Michelle Duggar) was throwing words like “pedophile” and “child molester” around at every individual she viewed to fall short of her ideal of wholesome perfection. Child advocates rant and rave about how the age of consent needs to be raised to 18 years old or older in every corner of the world and how wrong it is for any man over 21 years of age to have a girlfriend who is still in high school or middle school. However, I often find these same extremists campaigning for Hillary Clinton as the next president of the United States of America in 2016, even though she legally defended two men back in 1975 who brutally raped and put a 12-year-old girl into a coma. Hillary Clinton laughed about it 10 years later. That just makes no sense to me, and it shows you how hypocritical all these people who take the high road on this issue really are. Moreover, I don’t think Hillary Clinton would laugh about something like this if it had happened to her daughter, Chelsea Clinton, when she was that young.

        One of my cousins was 30 years old when he met his wife, who was then 15 years old. He has been married to her successfully for over 30 years. He is not a child molester or a pedophile. How do I know? Because a bald-headed man approached his stepdaughter when she was 3 years old and attempted to molest her, and my cousin immediately put a stop to this lowlife’s actions and told him that he would kill him if he ever got near his stepdaughter or any of his kids again. Conventional wisdom dictates that one child predator would not protect a kid from another child predator. Therefore, there is no way that my cousin could ever be a pedophile or a child molester, even if his marriage didn’t receive the seal of approval from the Puritanical Establishment along the lines of age-appropriate perfection at the beginning of its existence. Fact has it that the Puritanical Establishment is not always right about everything, and the issue being discussed here on this blog sheet is definitely one of the things that the Puritanical Establishment is not always right about. You’re going to have your opinions and I’m going to have mine, but neither of us can deny that this is a controversial issue that is not as in black and white as society might like it to be. I can assure you that the enterovirus is a much greater threat to kids than anyone on this blog sheet whose opinion you disagree with. I saw the science-fiction movie “THX 1138”; and even though that movie was originally made years ago, it is still timely today on what the world is turning into. If you see that movie, you’ll likely understand what I’m talking about.

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        Allow me to correct a typographical error. I typed “I know you think that the world would be a better place if we lived an age-appropriate Utopia, so to speak, where everyone kept to their own generation in their romantic pursuits, especially whenever adolescents were involved, but that just isn’t reality.”

        I actually meant to type, “I know you think that the world would be a better place if we lived in an age-appropriate Utopia, so to speak, where everyone kept to their own generation in their romantic pursuits, especially whenever adolescents were involved, but that just isn’t reality.”

  20. theasdgamer says:

    It’s important to consider fecundity as well as fertility. Women whose bodies are more curvy perhaps are more fecund. 36-24-36 is important for a reason. Maybe the reason is fecundity.

  21. theasdgamer says:

    I guess the fact that women are the gatekeepers of sex is so powerful, it ends up covering the old infertile women also.

    I don’t think that attraction and sex drive in men operate off of the same mechanism. Men will prefer more fecund women, but will chase postmenopausal wives for sex because of testosterone.

    • emmatheemo says:

      Makes sense. I forgot. But people do a lot of stuff that seems totally useless, evolutionarily speaking (masturbation, toys, animals, whatever, stuff like that). I read that some behavior is a byproduct of an adaption, not an adaption in itself.

  22. Lycere Cunningham says:

    Not only do people scream ‘pedo’ if someone expresses attraction to a minor, they also scream pedo to adults who express attraction to legal adults who happen to *look* underage. I’m a twenty-something woman who is short statured and gets mistaken for a child and have had to put up with people telling me that anyone who could ever find me attractive would be a pedophile, since my body is only the size of about the average 9 yo.

    • It sucks it’s like this too. I used to have a girlfriend that didn’t look any older than 12 and MAN did I get shit for it.

      I think a lot of it is jealousy though and it really only came in opposite ends. People either acted offended like as if it was just the worse thing ever or they acted with total envy and told me all the time how hot she was.

      Plus it’s disturbing when grow ass adults think that a 22 year old woman with 2 kids is someone I shouldn’t date because she LOOKS young. Like, what? Is she just supposed to go through life single forever because she looks youthful? What the hell sense does that make?

      Either way…as a 27 year old male I still hold onto my believe that the topic of this article is true. I have had very few friends in my life since being “of age” that wouldn’t have sex with less-than-18 year old female (yes this topic ALWAYS seems to come up…telling isn’t it?).

      Either way, whatever. People can act offended or scream “Pedo!” all day long. I know that I don’t feel weird about it…it’s just more annoying than anything.

      • RiC David says:

        “I have had very few friends in my life since being “of age” that wouldn’t have sex with less-than-18 year old female”

        Well when I breached the topic of attraction and age with my close circle of friends (I didn’t like some of the comments they’d made about “pedos” and wanted to establish if they meant child molesters or actual paedophiles), those who I know full well would (and may well have, let’s just say) have sex with a girl who was underage were the ones who reacted most angrily and with the most vehement denial when I said “we can’t honestly claim girls don’t become attractive until the day they turn 16, it doesn’t make sense on mutliple levels”.

        That’s the thing, we’re indirectly but very very clearly taught that we’re ‘not supposed to’ find girls attractive if they’re under 16 (or, conveniently, whatever the age of consent is where you grew up) but this doesn’t mesh with our actual experience of life. We see that something’s ‘out of place’ and it makes us feel uncomfortable and guilty so we deny it, try to supress it (all we supress is acknowledgement, we don’t remove it), and viciously attack anybody with the audacity to openly acknowledge it and not beat themselves up over it like we do.

        I really hope we continue to hold this up to the light and just accept what is there. Just three years ago I would be the lone voice in any forum or comments section, hounded by the rest. Now the balance has shifted to it being a few angry voices attacking the majority and calling them all “sick fucks” and “pedos” while we see the madness of denial for what it is. I mean it’s not even that big of a fucking issue – people of a broad age range look good. Done! I think they think if they admit that then they’ll be chasing schoolbuses or something.

    • drflra says:

      No secure man would ever think you were some kind of fringe indulgence or anything like that.

  23. Pettersen Olsen says:

    Men Being Attracted to 12 Year Old Girls is completely normal….. in pedo world!

    • Well according to a majority of scientists and therapists it is normal.

      It’s called human nature…natural human male instinct. You’d know this if you actually read anything here.

      Also, 12 year old’s isn’t considered pedophilia. Pedophilia, you ignorant fuck, is liking PRE-PUBESCENT girls…but you’d know that if you knew what you were talking about, huh?

      • Pettersen Olsen (ignorant fuck) says:

        Puberty can start as early as 8 years of age. Do you find 8 year old girls attractive? I did not think so either.
        You can’t hide behind your “ephebophilia” with this one.

      • And puberty can start a lot later, too. We’re talking averages here, obviously.

        Point still stands.

    • Pettersen Olsen (poorly evolved primate) says:

      Yeah, the average 12 year old girl is smoking hot. The childlike face…. The petite body. Yumm yumm.
      Mr. Andriodvageta. I hope you can forgive me for that silly pedo comment. I apologize.

  24. Pettersen Olsen (poorly evolved primate) says:

    “Pedophilia- the primary or exclusive sexual attraction to prepubescent children 13 years of age or younger.” http://dsm.psychiatryonline.org/book.aspx?bookid=556 Oh god, I am the most ignorant fuck in the universe! Please forgive me for being such a mangina! Peace out

    • emmatheemo says:

      “The reader should note (as Dr Blanchard has not) that the words “(generally under 13 years or younger)” appear in parentheses and are clearly meant to be merely illustrative, not definitive. The defining feature of Pedophilia is the preferential and intense interest in PREPUBESCENT children, not the specific age of the child. The parenthetical “(generally under 13 years or younger)” indicated only that most kids over thirteen would have attained puberty and should not be considered. The ruling issue is always the presence or absence of puberty, not age.

      When this criterion was written more than 20 years ago, puberty occurred much later than it does now and age 13 seemed an appropriate upper suggested limit, provided only for illustrative purposes. In the interval, the average age of onset has dropped so substantially that age 13 has become meaningless. This large drop in age of onset has in no way affected the current diagnosis of ‘Pedophilia’ precisely because it has always been the presence or absence of puberty that counts, not the age of the victim. If an illustrative age is kept at all in DSM 5, it should be lowered to reflect the current earlier onset of puberty- not raised upward in a futile attempt to sneak in ‘Hebephilia’.”

      http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/dsm5-in-distress/201202/sneaking-hebephilia-dsm-5

  25. Pettersen Olsen (poorly evolved primate) says:

    I do not know how to say it any clearer………
    Normal adult men are not attracted to 12 year olds. I know, I am a man.

    • Science and nature disagrees. I’m guessing you don’t believe in science and think nature is a scam?

      • Pettersen Olsen (poorly evolved primate) says:

        Finding kids sexually attractive is normal according to science and nature? I stand corrected.

      • To find the youngest, strongest, and most fertile attractive is animal nature. If you could comprehend information you’d learn that most professionals find this normal and not at all weird or uncommon. You seem to think that everyone that can look at a minor and think “wow, nice body” is also considering rape or some shit.

        Would I ever had sexual relations with a 14 year old? Hell no! But can I look at one and think she’s attractive and even sexy? Sure…why not? Young, smooth skin, and perky everything…isn’t that what every man REALLY wants? Why do you think barely legal 18 year old women do so well in porn? It’s because they’re…*GASP!*… Young, smooth skin, and perky everything! Well, except for the MILF and GILF type people…

        So, again, there’s nothing wrong with it in my eyes or many people’s eyes. It’s also the same, I would say based on observation, for both sides…men and women.

        Do you understand or are you going to argue some more?

      • Pettersen Olsen (poorly evolved primate) says:

        “Why do you think barely legal 18 year old women do so well in porn?”

        Because they are attractive? I thought we were talking about 12 year olds?

      • Either you’re just trolling now or you need to go back to using “Pettersen Olsen (ignorant fuck)”.

    • drflra says:

      Emma talks about how traits start appearing on girls that young and that men will find that those t r a i t s are attractive. You should actually read the blog you are posting on.

      • Pettersen Olsen (poorly evolved primate) says:

        It is just difficult for me to accept the fact that my fellow men are lusting after 6th graders. I can’t seem to wrap my head around it.

    • emmatheemo says:

      My point wasn’t that 12 y o are the best (IMO, the peak is between 13 and 30), just that they aren’t devoid of attractive traits just like older women aren’t (despite not being very fertile, or infertile).

    • macint00 says:

      I agree with you. These people are trying to justify themselves by using the whole “historical” argument and here is my rebuttal. We do not live in prehistoric or other past centuries where we did not know any better. We now know much much more about human development and psychology and that is why we know that it is extremely damaging to form sexual relationships with young children.
      Not only can you damage that child emotionally, you can also cause physical damage to that child. Any man or woman who tries to justify their predatory behavior towards young adolescents as “natural” has obviously not evolved.

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        But, you see, macintoo? I could easily counter your argument by citing the fact that many Christian fundamentalists use excerpts from the Bible to condemn any relationship between an adolescent girl and an adult man as morally depraved and wrong. The Bible is probably the oldest publication in the world with the most outdated ethics promoted therein. Therefore, we’re right back to where we started from regarding history vs. modern day views. The assertion that an adult man or woman who falls in love with a young adolescent and acts on those feelings is engaging in predatory behavior is still an argument rather than a conclusion of fact. While there is a much more unified consensus within the American culture that adults who have sexual contact with a toddler of 2 or 3 years of age are child rapists and must be stopped, the beat of the drum continues to pound over the differences that Americans have of opinion on whether it is possible for an adult man to be in a relationship with an adolescent girl that is non-exploitative. These differences of opinion clash with those of other cultures inasmuch as the United States of America is a melting pot of different ethnic groups and races. I once saw a documentary about Guatemala, and it revealed that it was common for teenage girls, even preteen girls, to get married and start a family. Among the couples that were interviewed, only one of the teenage girls was married to a young man who was close to her in age difference. A controversial film that delves into this subject matter is a documentary titled “Are All Men Pedophiles?” by movie director Jan Willem-Breure that was released in 2012. Dr. Judith Levine’s book titled “Harmful to Minors; the Perils of Protecting Children from Sex” sparked just as much controversy upon its publication back in 2002. However, this woman appeared to be knowledgeable on this subject matter whenever she was interviewed on television.

  26. derfla says:

    Is this actress in your opinion a good example of what you are talking about?

    We’re supposed to think of her as a baby, but I see nothing even remotely resembling that physically yet people are palpably afraid to state the obvious amongst strangers/in public.

    • derfla says:

      meant to post this link: http://i.imgur.com/ZOTIa48.jpg

    • emmatheemo says:

      Well, it’s hard to find good pics, but I remember watching those trashy talk shows (stuff like “My daughter is 12 and had 3 babies”) and I remember being struck by how non-childlike these kids often looked. Of course, a lot of 12 year olds still look childlike, but enough of them do not. When I was that age, I looked like a kid, but my friends did not.

      The actress in your link is 16 though, isn’t she?

      • andriodvageta says:

        Puberty hit’s at all ages. I remember being in 5th grade and there being a chick that was taller than all of us, already had at least a C-cup and looked much older than any of us…at least high school age. But was she? No. She was 11-12 years old just like the rest of us.

        This is why I never really look at age when admiring another person. The little hottie I’m checking out could be 12 or 36…doesn’t matter. Call it instinct, natural, or just being a perv but I look because what I see I think is attractive…not because they’re a certain age.

        As far as actresses like Chloe goes, I think a lot of her attraction is part of her playing more mature roles in movies. They make her seem a lot older and mature than she may actually be. That and her lips…even when she was younger in, say, Kick-Ass I remember thinking, “damn them is some sexy lips!”.

  27. derfla says:

    i mean she was 15 in that picture, well within outrage in the US.

  28. Jay says:

    Thank you for this post Emma, I really enjoyed it. I am a “Normal” 34 year old Male.

  29. amazingly says:

    Physical development in children in their teenage years, must not be confused with emotional and physcological growth – they both operate on two distinct important levels. No teenage person who is under the age of 16, is emotionally ‘adult’ enough to manage the complexity of their premature; evolving maturation. Just because a 12-16 year old, may appear carefree in their developing bodies – does not at all mean that they are therefore ’emotionally’ mature to process adult thoughts and feelings. Male adults who lust after children who are between the ages of 12-16, rarely align emotional immaturity with that of physical progress, when the feelings of the individual victim are typically disregarded.

    • RiC David says:

      I realise your heart’s in the right place with this but I really, *really* wish just once we could discuss what is truly normal (common, standard) attraction without people reading clearly defined, clearly spoken words and coming away saying “it’s not okay for adults to have sex with kids!”.

      Yeah, we know that and nobody said it was. Again, I know you’re posting your comment ‘just in case’ but it’s depressing that as a society/community we insist on muddling these two separate topics. There’s always this heavy feeling of “we can’t acknowledge this because then people will think it’s okay to have sex with someone because they’re attractive” and that just doesn’t make sense. I’m bisexual but I don’t have to delude myself that a straight guy isn’t attractive lest I convince myself that it’s okay to force myself on him.

      It already is what it is whether we go on kidding ourselves that somehow specific ages have near magical properties. If none of this really applies to you then, well, I wanted to vent on it anyway. I didn’t dare read the entire comments section because the nastiness often encountered really bothers me – yours just caught my eye.

  30. RiC David says:

    This became a hot issue for me a few years ago when I saw through the flimsy and all around impossible illusion that is the claim that we (female attracted males, specifically) only find females attractive from age 16. Most readers would expect me to say 18 as this is the common age of consent in the U.S., and the culturally established ‘of age’ number whereas here in England 16 is the age of consent and thus the age at which all but the introspective and intellectually ‘open’ of my peers claim the opposite sex becomes attractive.

    I took a liking to a girl/woman I saw photos of online (from an indie band) and I literally couldn’t tell if she was 13 or 30. I saw myself hold off on acknowledging that she was attractive until I discovered her age (mid 20s) and for the first time I fully acknowledged how dishonest this was. Upon further reflection I realised that even though she was in her 20s, if she’d been 13 as I initially thought, I’d have just lied to myself and anybody who asked. I then also realised that if she had been 13 and I’d admitted that she was attractive, this couldn’t possibly make me ‘a bad person’ because I have zero choice in the matter – only a choice between denial or acceptance. Finally I realised that no matter what a person’s age, a person can never be blamed if their eyes/brain sees them as attractive; we’ve completely missed the mark by blaming the person because we dislike the concept as though they get to choose what looks attractive.

    Honestly it’s maddening to see how obviously full of shit we are and how we condition one another to play the game of denial and shaming/attacking anybody who points out the facade. It can be dismantled so easily: as you say, people don’t physically develop overnight on the day of their 16th/18th birthday. Nobody would deny that. Therefore if they’re attractive at age 18 they must have been attractive at *some* point before that, so is it one day? one week? month? The obvious answer is that different individuals look different at different ages – the other gaping flaw in the impossible claim. There are 17 year olds who look 20 and 20 year olds who look 17. You see this with girls like Emma Watson, Chloe Moretz, Selena Gomex – to avoid being shamed by their peers/their own socially conditioned mind, most adult males will not admit they’re attractive (“they’re going to be attractive when they’re older!” they somehow know) until the moment they’re 18 at which point they’ll openly discuss sexual desires (often crudely) even though they obviously look no different than they did a month ago. For a man to claim 19 year old Emma Watson was “hot” but 17 year old Emma was not is ridiculous when they look virtually identical or at least too similar for somehow only one to look like an attractive human being.

    The simple, obvious, and self evident reality is that we adjust what we allow ourselves to acknowledge based on what we discover their age to be. We’ve mixed up the morality over having sex with someone with somebody looking attractive – our language doesn’t help with terms like “find them attractive”, seemingly suggesting it’s a decision or act. In the past I’ve lost a lot of sleep over the nasty, spiteful and downright vile responses I’ve gotten for breaching this taboo subject and I wish it didn’t cause so many people to angrily discard all honest reason based assessment. Of course males find adolescent/pubescent females attractive, that’s the entire point of puberty/adolescence – to achieve and display fertility. That’s not a political argument or some radical stance, that’s stating the way the human body/brain functions. Note that I have no inclination to entertain any idiot that reads this and says “he’s trying to say men should fuck children!”.

  31. P.O says:

    You guys can look but dont touch, that`s fine & dandy. To me, 12 year olds look like kids.
    I might be the abnormal one here but I can certainly live with that.

    Cheers.:-)

  32. Romolo says:

    I find girls as young as 10 sexually attractive sometimes, but obviously never tell anyone because it’s socially unacceptable. I’m 21.
    And before you flame me, I can’t help it. Doesn’t mean I’m going to do anything, I just find a lot of them hot.

    • emmatheemo says:

      Interesting. What ages are you most attracted to?

      • Scott Vater says:

        In lieu of your posts…what ages are you most attracted to?

      • emmatheemo says:

        Me? I suppose 20 to 40 for men. For women, I find many beautiful, listed in this post: https://emmatheemo.wordpress.com/2014/04/05/most-beautiful-women-ever-a-list/ I guess they range from 15 to almost 40.

      • Scott Vater says:

        That’s about what I would have expected. It’s curious in that I’ve often found that women are more attracted to the same sex when it comes to younger ages. Most women that I’ve met (that will admit or talk about it) often find older men more attractive and younger women to girls attractive.

        I wonder why that is considering their lack of a natural drive towards women…let alone younger ones. I know a few women that think lower than 15 is even attractive…a lot lower.

        Hmm…interesting.

      • emmatheemo says:

        Interesting observations. Maybe men and women understand female beauty the same way, at least when they are honest and aren’t ego-invested (in case of women) or scared of looking shallow or predatory (in case of men).

      • Scott Vater says:

        Oh for sure. Either way I think it’s definitely better for society for people to not let things like this be widely known…trust me. I have found out a lot about a lot of people that I can honestly say should have been left in the dark. Luckily for me finding young teens attractive is really my only major kink which for the longest time I thought was “wrong” and “bad”…oh if I only knew then what I knew now about how a lot of people around me think. Would have been good to know that I was a lot more better off than I thought!

      • emmatheemo says:

        What is wrong with knowing these things? Of course, it’s kind of socially ungraceful to go around talking about what’s hot to you, but beyond that, I don’t entirely understand the concern. You yourself were relieved by finding out you were normal, and that took knowing other people’s desires.

      • Scott Vater says:

        True…I guess it’s finding out dark or out of character stuff about people. Like a buddy of mine that’s all macho but likes his girlfriend to buttfuck him in the ass with a strap on…did NOT need to know that one…or my cousin (female) that is a straight pedo…and yes I mean a REAL pedo.

        So yeah…I guess in the end it has helped me feel better about myself but it has also…tainted…several relationships to a certain degree. Not that I look DOWN on these people but it’s just kind of awkward. To hear my buddy talking about “fuckin some dude up that talked shit” all while in the back of my head thinking “is that before or after you got screwed up the poop shoot?”

        Yeah…that sort of thing. I mean hey…we all have our kinks I guess, eh?

      • emmatheemo says:

        Lol, ok, I get it. I guess it can turn awkward. Not sure what I would think or how I’d react if one of my friends had a totally unexpected kink (I know a lot of them, so it would take something really weird to make it awkward for me). Perhaps I’d prefer just not to think about it.

      • Scott Vater says:

        Exactly…like I said…somethings are better kept a deep dark secret never to come out haha! 😉

    • Scott Vater says:

      Don’t feel bad. My thing is that while some peoples perversions may be wrong to a certain extent (like those that lust over two year olds) the fact is that at the end of the day we can’t help what we like.

      Most important part is just not to act on them, really. Also not to go around telling everyone everything you like, either. If we all knew each others secrets and desires things would probably be VERY dark…in fact I know things would be very dark. I’ve known rather normal upstanding people that I have found out have quite disturbing tastes. One woman I knew (notice the past tense there) got turned on by watching people die or getting tortured ala Faces of Death type stuff.

      So yeah…being attracted to 10 year olds, in my experience, could be considering PRETTY mild over all. Plus, it’s considered pretty natural by many as well.

      Either way, like I said, like what ever you want…just don’t act on it and if you’re going to explore it say, online, just don’t get caught! :-p

    • sigfreud says:

      I agree, there something about 10 year old girls that is so attractive. They are so pretty and starting to get their womanly shapes. They are still children no doubt, but they are just coming into the cusp of womanhood. I would never have anything sexual to do with a 10 year old. But I don’t think I’m a pedophile to think they are beautiful because 10 is the age many females hit puberty. So it stands to reason that a man would find a female near or at the point when she becomes fertile attractive.

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        Well, let me just say this, sigfreud. Beware of charlatans like Dr. James Cantor. He calls himself the expert on pedophilia, but nothing could be further from the truth. Just like late Congressman Joseph McCarthy started a Red Scare in the 1950s by falsely accusing everyone he could of being a closet communist, Dr. James Cantor is trying to do the same thing with all the hysteria there is regarding pedophilia.>>>Click onto https://philiaresearch.wordpress.com/2015/01/26/pedophilia-and-iq-more-research-needed/comment-page-1/#comment-43
        I found out about this creep from some right-wing nut on YouTube who follows his teachings as well as those of Dr. Ray Blanchard, who is yet ANOTHER CHARLATAN!

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        Also, sigfreud, like late Congressman Joseph McCarthy, beware the fact that Dr. James Cantor is also an American living here in the United States of America.

  33. Pettis sad says:

    I see 12-13 year olds that have done ballet their entire lives thus they have developed the legs, hips, and torso of a super model. Their graceful, confident, and their innocence is alluring. Fear of getting caught is the only thing stopping me.

  34. Subliminal Portal says:

    It’s very difficult to separate the politics from this issue. In any event, I must warn everyone here that what I am about to say ultimately in this comment is likely going to bring about a consensus among everyone on this blog sheet. When looking into the politics of this issue, we have to look into the legislative history of it as well as the sociological history of it as well here in the United States of America. One way to do so is reading about the evolution of our age of consent laws from the time before our ancestors came over here from the Eastern Hemisphere on up to the present. Click onto http://chnm.gmu.edu/cyh/teaching-modules/230

    The most notorious point in history concerning this issue was the 1990s when Hillary Clinton in her role as First Lady influenced her husband and numerous legislators throughout our country to raise the age of consent in each state to 16, 17, or 18 years old. (Keep in mind that as late as the early 1990s, there were still states in our country where the age of consent was between 12 and 15 years old.) I know about this historical event, because I used to work for a social services agency. The way that Hillary Clinton achieved this goal was to influence her husband and Congress to pass a Federal law that would reform the welfare system, changing A.F.D.C. (Aid to Families with Dependent Children) to T.A.N.F. (Temporary Assistance to Needy Families). The major complaint about this change of law was that A.F.D.C. provided cash welfare benefits to the underprivileged indefinitely whereas T.A.N.F. only provided money to welfare recipients for two years max. However, what was not really talked about in the press and the media was the fact that this Federal law also cut off welfare-related funding from the Federal government to any state that refused to raise its age of consent to 16, 17, or 18 years old. In other words, states that kept their ages of consent at 12, 13, 14, or 15 years old stood the threat of losing Federal funding for their welfare programs. After there was publicity of an incident in which a 13-year old girl hooked up with a 58-year old man on the Internet and went to shack up with him after her 14th birthday in New Hampshire where the age of consent was 14 years old at the time, Hillary Clinton’s support from others for this Federal bill and eventually Federal law grew throughout the 1990s.

    By the year 2000, the lowest age of consent anywhere in the United States of America was 16 years old. Hawaii was the last state to raise its age of consent to 16 and above. Hawaii’s age of consent was 14 years old before then. There was an upside and a downside to this so-called reform in our country’s state-by-state age of consent laws. Unfortunately, there was much more of a downside to this massive change of age of consent laws than an upside. The upside to this massive change in our country’s age of consent laws was that prosecutors were now able to use these news laws as bulletproof vests against the “seduction” defense in forcible rape cases involving victims younger than 16 years of age. Of course, then again, anybody could have presented the same argument for raising the age of consent to 16, 17, or 18 years old in every state as far back as in the 1960s when our country was undergoing a problem with outlaw bikers like the Hell’s Angels and the Pagans kidnapping 12-year old girls and turning them into involuntary baby machines. It didn’t necessarily mean that it would have been the best course of action for lawmakers to take throughout the country. The downside that our country suffered from this reactionary swing of the pendulum with our age of consent laws caused irreparable harm to us all as a society and as a culture in that innocent individuals were caught up in the crossfire of these new laws. The downside to this agenda that Hillary Clinton successfully forced upon the American people materialized in the form of either unjust criminal convictions or severe social ostracism or both against individuals who were wrongfully caught in its line of fire. Click onto http://laurenperez.blogspot.com/2009/08/pure-and-simple-truth.html
    Click onto http://www.westword.com/2004-06-17/news/age-inappropriate/
    Click onto http://www.al.com/specialreport/mobileregister/index.ssf?childbride9.html
    This downside that our country experienced eventually spiraled way out of control in the form of extraterritorial laws that exported “18 years old” as the age of consent for Americans travelling abroad. It became costly to American taxpayers for our government to fly witnesses and their families to the U.S. for court proceedings every time some American 19 or 20-year old college student was arrested on suspicion of becoming intimate with a 14 or 15-year old girl he met at a party in some country like Austria or Denmark where their society, their law-enforcement officials, and even parents usually didn’t even care about their adolescent daughters hooking up with older men. Hillary Clinton’s agenda became more like a moral crusade than an actual collective effort to protect the youth of our nation.

    Now I want everyone on this blog sheet to listen to what I have to say. Regardless of whether you feel that the age of consent here in the United States of America should be 12 or 13 or 17 or 18 or even 21, I think all of you are going to be quite shocked about what I have to say and you’re all going to agree completely with what I am about to tell you. Hillary Clinton claimed that she pushed to raise the age of consent in every state that she could back in the 1990s, because she was a champion of women and young girls. However, nothing could ever be further than the truth than that. She only did it to serve her own special interests. Here is a hypocrite who actually has plans to run for president in 2016. Here is the proof in the pudding as to what I am talking about. In 1975, Hillary Clinton represented two men who brutally raped a 12-year old girl and put her into a coma for 5 days. As a result of Hillary Clinton’s predatory legal practices, one of her clients got just a slap on the wrist for what he did and her other client was completely acquitted of the criminal charges. Hillary Clinton even found it laughable that she had gotten one of her client’s criminal charges reduced to a misdemeanor. She joked about the 12-year old girl’s ordeal and tragedy like it was something humorous. Here is the online article regarding this event. Click onto http://www.bizpacreview.com/2014/06/21/rape-victim-confronts-hillary-for-taking-her-through-hell-in-75-i-hear-you-on-the-tape-laughing-126847
    Here are the court documents to this same incident back in 1975. Click onto http://www.scribd.com/doc/229667084/State-of-Arkansas-V-Thomas-Alfred-Taylor

    EVERYONE ON THIS BLOG SHEET, LISTEN UP! You may not agree completely with one another or you may not agree with one another at all on the subject matter that Emma has presented. However, it is quite clear that each and every one of you are intelligent individuals. I can be rest assured that each and every one of you have to agree with me that Hillary Clinton should not be elected as president of the United States of America in 2016. This woman is a hypocrite and a destroyer. She is not a champion of women and girls. If she gets into the oval office, she will destroy this country just as she destroyed the life of the 12-year old girl that her two clients brutally raped back in 1975. I feel in a lot of ways she destroyed our country back in the 1990s with her above described agenda that raised the age of consent in many states; but if she is elected president, it will definitely be the end of life as we know it here in the United States of America. Feel free to do your own research, but don’t let your guard down for even one moment between now and when the time comes that we all have to go to the polls two years from now and decide who is going to lead our nation.

    Don’t get me wrong. I want to see a woman get elected president to this nation in my lifetime, but I don’t want it to be Hillary Clinton. I think Elizabeth Warren would make a good candidate, but that’s just me. I’ve spoken my conscience. I’ve read all of your comments and you all have been wonderful. The discussion on this blog sheet has been handled in a much more civilized manner than I have seen on a lot of YouTube pages dealing in this same subject matter.

    P.S. – Emma? I know you may not think that this blog sheet was the appropriate forum to put this entire story out there, but I just had to get it off my chest. For my sake and this nation’s sake. Please allow for it to be posted.

    • Subliminal Portal says:

      Just for the record, Hillary Rodham Clinton was a criminal defense attorney back in 1975, but I assume that you all have figured that out by now from reading the articles mentioned in my post above.

    • Emma the Emo says:

      Thanks for that, it’s quite a lot of info. But very interesting.

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        You’re welcome, Emma. And thank you for replying to my post. I’ve read all of your viewpoints on this blog sheet and I find that they bear a strong resemblance to those of Heather Corinna. Click onto http://www.femmerotic.com/wordsamps/nonficsamp2.html
        That’s a good thing! It is a commendable attribute that you know how to think outside the box. Dr. Roni Cohen-Sandler and Naomi Wolf proclaim themselves to be experts on this subject matter, and I respect them both greatly. However, the problem I have with their teachings and viewpoints is that they demonstrate a strong propensity to adhere to the so-called mainstream’s perspective on these same issues without fairly assessing all the facts. If you compare their publications both online and offline with those of Heather Corinna, you’ll see exactly what I mean. There needs to be a greater exercise in freedom of thought when these so-called experts discuss these kinds of issues. Otherwise, our nation will continue to lag behind other nations in the way our laws, our communities, and our public institutions deal with this subject matter. The Netherlands has an edge over our nation in how it does so. Last time I checked, I heard that that country had a government agency named the Council for the Protection of Children. That is, even though the age of consent in their country is 16 years old, this agency has been set up to allow for adolescents between 12 and 15 years old to contest a charge of unlawful carnal knowledge or “statutory rape” that has been brought against their older significant other. This agency has been empowered to evaluate such grievances and compel a judge to permanently vacate a case of unlawful carnal knowledge or statutory rape from his/her court docket if this agency finds that the criminal charge(s) against a suspect are unjust and persecutory in nature regardless of whether or not there was actual sexual contact between the alleged “victim” and the accused. If we had such a government agency with that kind of authority here in the United States of America, I can be sure that probably many of these frivolous unlawful carnal knowledge and “statutory rape” cases involving adolescent minors would not likely see the light of day. It would save taxpayers a whole mint also in the form of less people needlessly serving time behind bars or receiving welfare benefits because they have been unjustly forced to register as sex offenders and have become virtually unemployable as a result.

    • Eivind Berge says:

      Great comment! Hillary Clinton is clearly evil for helping to raise the age of consent and I hope she never gets to be president, but you can’t fault her for getting her clients’ criminal charges reduced back when she was working as a lawyer. Indeed it would be unethical for a defense attorney not to exploit every legal means available in the interest of her clients. It is certainly not the job of a lawyer representing an accused rapist to be a “champion of women and young girls”! Any criminal defense attorney doing that deserves to be disbarred immediately.

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        Thank you, Mr. Berge. And as I said before, Elizabeth Warren will make a much better candidate for president. Unlike Hillary Clinton, her ideologies actually make sense and she doesn’t go using people to further her own special interests. Hillary Clinton is only looking out for Number One. President Obama is out of his mind to endorse her as this country’s next president. If she gets into office, the country will have no way of recovering from the irreparable harm that she’ll do on top of all the irreparable harm she already did to our nation back in the 1990s when she was First Lady. Also, although I can appreciate your viewpoint that it was her duly obligation as a professional litigator to defend those two clients of hers back in 1975 despite the heinous nature of their crimes, the fact that she acted so casual about it in her interview with a news reporter in the 1980s still goes to show you that she doesn’t have the sensitivity and humanity in her to lead an entire nation with fairness and compassion towards the same people that she so claims to advocate. And you’re right. She should have been disbarred from the practice of law a long time ago. It puzzles me how she was able to keep all these things from her past under wraps for so long, especially when she was going around the country back in the 1990s, shooting her mouth off to women and young girls on how she was going to do everything in her power to get states to raise their respective ages of consent to 18 years old as though she really had their best interests at heart when nothing could have been further from the truth. Our country is now feeling the resulted impact of her damage in the form of our overgrown prison populations and the astronomical number of wrongfully convicted individuals whose names don’t belong on any sex offender registry but are so. Kevin Gillson was among the first of innocent individuals who were caught in the line of fire of Hillary Clinton’s agenda to raise the age of consent in every state and even toughen these laws to a magnitude of absurdity. Click onto http://articles.latimes.com/1997-06-25/news/mn-6679_1_sexual-offender
        And Kevin Gillson was only three years older than his girlfriend, who was pregnant with his baby at the time. Both his life and his girlfriend’s lives were both ruined, and their child will likely not have the quality of life it would have had otherwise.

  35. emmatheemo says:

    Wow, would you look at all those manginas: http://fstdt.com/QuoteComment.aspx?QID=102459
    Look, I was 12-13 once. I had friends of the same age. I know that around this point, men become visibly more attracted to a girl. The ones I met did nothing except carefully hit on me. And many ran away once they heard my age. Some didn’t and continued trying to get further with me. Same with my friends (even some male ones). I know those people aren’t pedophiles, because pedophilia is a rare condition – it would be hard to meet so many pedophiles in one day. And pedophiles don’t suddenly swarm you once you start to look more adult.
    Anyone going “I can’t see anything attractive in 13 y olds and don’t understand how anyone can be attracted to them, they look like kids to me!” is likely either brainwashed, or living in a society where 13 y o don’t eat enough and really look like kids. But probably brainwashed, if they hang out on a site like FSTDT. Ideology/religion can sure mess with people’s perception.

  36. bob says:

    I’m sorry but all the people which think that All children are not sexual, and therefore cannot consent are just plain ignorant, (and the culprits of voting for stupid laws/ the whole reason we have wars, disease pain suffering, a secret government slowly poisoning and killing off the population without anyone even noticing. The USA has one of the highest pregnancy and disease rates BECAUSE OF OUR BAD NEGATIVE ATTITUDES/LACK OF EDUCATION TOWARDS SEX. We are spiritual beings and sex is part of our evolution/ spiritual development. Many come into this world years ahead of their time only to have their senses, believes and creativity stripped away by the 95% of unaware people around us. As such everyone is mature and ready at their pace. Some will not be ready for sex until 16-18+, the average will be ready by 12-14 and some will seek out sex as young as 8. Seriously if your old enough to enjoy self stimulation by yourself you are likely old enough to enjoy and want to try it with someone else. Put aside the programming/brain washing of society for a minute and think back to before you were a dull narrow closed minded boring adult. I can clearly remember seeking out sexual stimulation with other pairs since I was 8 which was 3 years AFTER I discovered and learned about my own body senses. About 20-30% of my school pairs were also engaging in sexual stimulation activity with others. And by middle school it was more like 50%. Now or days children are evolving and developing from even earlier ages then ever.
    Furthermore the ones whom I knew which had those happy childhood memories/experiences to reflect back upon have grown up to have a good adult future as well, are healthy well off and many successful in general. But the ones which did NOT have those close friendships/relationships lacked love and affection in general, allowed others to control how they should think, all either have regrets of lost opportunities and or have had many not good things in their life happen. Not the law, not the government not society has any business to take away your god given right to decide at what age, what gender, and who/ when you want to/are ready to share your body and love with another human being.

    • catrobone says:

      I agree that human sexuality has nothing to do with the age of a child. I feel to repress such desires is counter productive and dangerous. I feel that although they may be sexual being that adults shouldn’t be a part of the experience. I am drawn to young girls but I have never crossed the line

    • Subliminal Portal says:

      It’s the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children that promotes these kinds of nonsensical laws. Back in 1984, when that organization was first established, it did a lot of good things to protect small children from sexual predators. However, once these same people started poking their noses into the age of consent laws across the nation and making it a crime for young people closer and closer in age difference to have sex with each other every year that passed by, they transformed their organization from a well-meaning group of child protection crusaders to a bloated, overly corrupt, and greedy gestapo. Read this article about some of the shocking things this organization has done and you’ll see that it is not much different than the Church of Scientology in terms of the transgressions its employees have committed against the United States of America and the world at large.>>>>>Click onto http://www.childlaw.us/protect_ncmec/
      They call themselves a non-profit organization, but quite a few of the people that work for that organization receive a six figure income a year. Their president even received a half a million dollars in salary in one year alone.

  37. catrobone says:

    I am attracted to female as young as twelve, I’ve had these feeling since I was young myself. I love their physical appearance the anatomy of a young girl budding and the learning of her new self is somehow appealing to me. I have never touched or fondle a young girl of any age unless she was of legal age but the attraction is there. I know some may think it’s a sick thing me feeling this way but my only crime is looking.

    • Subliminal Portal says:

      Well, here’s the deal, catrobone. When we were young boys, our parents and society taught us that by the time we got to middle school we needed to be paying attention to pubescent and adolescent girls (12 years old and older) and admiring them in a sexual way. My father would even point girls that age out to me when I was 14 years old. However, what our parents and society makes the mistake of teaching us when we’re, say, 14 or 13 or 12 years old is that when we get to be 18, 19 or 20 years old, we’re going to grow this light switch on our bodies that we can flip off every time a cute-looking middle school or high school girl smiles at us and says “hi” as they walk by so that we don’t notice them at all. Well, that’s not how it plays out in the real world. Especially when these girls have very well-developed figures for their tender years, so to speak. It’s like if you’re at your community pool and you see a 14-year-old girl walk your way and she has a better figure and a larger bust line than quite a few college girls you’ve met, your brain may tell you one thing but your hormones will probably tell you another thing. Welcome to the wide, wonderful world of manhood.

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        And what I said about the 14-year-old girl at the community pool in my above example is something that I must stress if that girl just happens to be wearing a sexy bikini. However, I think you already knew I already had that one detail in mind in my above example to make my point.

  38. yamamanama says:

    Can the mind vomit?

  39. yamamanama says:

    Ugh, yes, the mind can, in fact, vomit.

  40. Matthew Chiglinsky says:

    12? I thought 14 would be safer. It gives a couple years of leeway.

    http://agalltyr.wordpress.com/2013/08/27/statutory-rape-isnt-really-rape/

    But what about 12-year-old girls with no pubic hair? Wait. What about 22-year-old girls with no pubic hair? Practically speaking, I think the ideal biological age for conception is the mid 20s (pubic hair or not).

    It is interesting though, most of the hot girls I see walking around in public are with guys who are taller than they are, like there’s some father-daughter Freudian thing going on. I also find myself attracted to girls who are younger than I am, so I guess I’m not that weird. I think the best way to avoid being a pedophile when you like young girls is to wait until you are 30 and then date 20-year-olds.

    • Subliminal Portal says:

      Matthew? There is currently a movement within the American Psychiatric Association to change the cutoff point for “pedophilia” from 13 years old to 11 years old.>>>>Click ontohttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pedophilia That is, if they make this change in the diagnosis for pedophilia, shrinks across the nation will no longer be able to diagnose adult men as being pedophiles unless they are attracted to girls younger than 11 years old. Interestingly enough, when the word “pedophile” was first coined in the late 1800s, there was no specific or exact definition of it in the “Diagnostic or Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders” or any medical books until nearly a hundred years later. That is, 1980. When the Viennese psychiatrist Richard von Krafft-Ebing first coined the word “pedophilia” in his writing “Psychopathia Sexualis” in 1886, it was quite common for girls as young as 12 or 13 years old to marry significantly older men. Therefore, he and his cohorts must have had several loopholes or another in mind when they first coined the word. If you go to a website here online and try to translate the words “hebephilia” and “ephebophilia” from English into Portuguese, you’ll notice that these words do not appear to translate into the Portuguese language. My belief for this being so is because the Portuguese-speaking culture (Portugal and Brazil) do not appear to recognize that adult men who take an attraction to adolescent girls, 12 years old and older, have anything psychiatrically wrong with them and, therefore, they do not recognize these two so-called disorders, if you want to call them that. If you have ever heard the 1961 song titled “The Girl From Ipanema” from Brazil, the lyrics of that song are about a 14-year-old girl whose intense beauty wins the interest of a 50-something-year-old man whose heart breaks as he gawks at her on the beach and she walks straight ahead to the sea without paying him a second look. In other words, this stigma that gets attached to adult men showing an extra-platonic interest in adolescent girls 12 years old and older appears to be purely an American-originated custom or rather an American-originated hang-up.

    • Subliminal Portal says:

      Matthew? Oops. That article I was trying to bring your attention to can be found by clicking onto http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pedophilia
      For some reason, after I posted my reply to you, the system sort of slopped all the words and letters together. Sorry for any confusion it caused.

    • Subliminal Portal says:

      Matthew? Another clarification I’d like to make is to this statement of mine: [If you go to a website here online and try to translate the words “hebephilia” and “ephebophilia” from English into Portuguese, you’ll notice that these words do not appear to translate into the Portuguese language.]
      What I was talking about was any translation website where you can translate a word or text from one language to another.

  41. Abc says:

    Professor Tromovitch and the psychologist Bruce Rind (of Temple University) in 1998 published an article based on a peer-reviewed meta-analysis of 59 studies which used the self-reported experiences of child sexual contact with adults by 35,703 college students. A substantial majority of the people in this study did not report any harmful effects of (non-coercive) sexual experiences (as opposed to victims of coercion), and a substantial minority even stated these intergenerational sexual contacts and relationships had a positive effect on their life. This article was published in the Psychological Bulletin, the prestigious, official journal of the American Psychological Association (APA).

    Predictably, this caused a storm in the mass media and in the political elite. Apparently for the first time in US history, both the US House of Representatives and the US Senate condemned this scientific paper and threatened to withdraw funding from the APA, so the APA apologised for publishing it. 12 past and present presidents of the Society for the Scientific Study of Sex sharply protested against the APA’s response to the public and political pressure surrounding the study, stating that it “cast a chill on all such research”. The American Association for the Advancement of Science refused APA’s request to review the study, stating they saw “no reason to second-guess the process of peer review used by the APA journal in its decision to publish” and that they “saw no clear evidence of improper application of methodology or other questionable practices on the part of the article’s authors”.

    More recently, the Harvard lecturer Susan Clancy came to the similar conclusions in her book “The Trauma Myth”. In the 1970s and 1980s, Donald West, Professor of Criminology from the University of Cambridge, advocated the abolition of the age of consent in scholarly books. See also Professor Richard Green’s article (he is a psychiatrist from Cambridge University and UCL) “Is Paedophilia a Mental Disorder”.

    In the words of Karin Freimond (“Navigating the Stigma of Pedophilia:
    The Experiences of
    Nine Minor-Attracted Men in Canada”, Department of Sociology and Anthropology, Simon Frasier University, 2013): “Many adults who are attracted to minors experience intense suffering as a result of contemporary attitudes about them and current methods of relating to them. Even when no crimes have taken place and no sexual interaction with people below the age of consent has occurred, people who are sexually interested in children and adolescents encounter incredible stigma. They experience fear about the possibility of their desires becoming known to others, and they cope with depression, anxiety, and suicidal thoughts. These individuals are often completely alone in dealing with their feelings, as they may be too worried about the negative consequences that could arise from talking to loved ones. Further, they may feel restricted in seeking help from therapists, as mandatory reporting laws in many jurisdictions require counsellors to report their clients to the police if they express sexual interest in children. If the nature of their sexuality is revealed, these people are at risk of experiencing physical violence, losing relationships with their friends and families, being fired from their jobs, and encountering financial destitution. The situation facing this population is troubling, and researchers argue that a new, more compassionate approach is needed in order to help people who are attracted to children lead more positive lives (see Cantor, 2012; Goode, 2010).”

    Much more pleasurable to dehumanise all the paedos regardless of their behaviour, to cage them or drive them to suicide. As Felix Guattari wrote (“A Shock to Thought: Expression After Deleuze and Guattari”), there is a certain “Jewishness” about paedophiles which provokes a “racist” reaction.

  42. God Destroyer says:

    shesh,your overthink’n it way too much.fact is a guy doesnt really give a shit about ‘oh she fertile,ohhh she not how am i gonna pass my genes onto to keep my proud family going for hundreds of years to come!?’ its about nostalgia mid life crisis for older men and ego stretch if they going after 18 yr old lady.think less honor for passing on genes and carving out a new generation and more self honor.that shit normal, but what im here for is to debate why any adult man would ‘lust ‘ over a 12 year old chick? lets leave burn the pedo’s on the stake topic on the backburner,i just want to figure out why the human brain would rewire its desires to such an acute age group? you didnt even mention this age range,just shitting all over the 20 yr olds and up,everybody discussed tat shit ages ago friend! im a smart fuck and adventurer with finding out new knowledge,and here im way away finding out shit nobody think of even knowing 😀 but yeah,a mighty fine question i have,leave your pitchforks at home and replace them with thinking hats,this knowledge is gonna be good to know in this day and age lmao

    • ” guy doesnt really give a shit about ‘oh she fertile,ohhh she not how am i gonna pass my genes onto to keep my proud family going for hundreds of years to come!?’ ”

      Of course he doesn’t think that, his genes “think” that.

  43. copperti says:

    I guess the fact that women are the gatekeepers of sex is so powerful”

    Because of thoughts like this, is why we have MGTOW, Men Going Their Own Way. If I choose to be a gatekeeper of sex, I can be and I am a male. This arcane way of thinking it has caused such a disconnect between men and women.

    https://www.mgtow.com/

  44. I just found out my fiance fucked a 14-year-old when he was in his 20s. I was fucked by other women – and one man – who were 37+ when I was 14/15
    . It just don’t sit right with me.

    • Subliminal Portal says:

      Lottie? When I was 16 years old, my father told me and my mother that he had dated a 13-year-old girl when he was 19 years old and stationed in Florida in the Air Force. He told us that he had thought she was 17 years old and she had thought he was only 15 years old when they first started dating, because she looked older than her age and he looked younger than his age. He told us that after he found out her true age, he then broke up with her. Not too long thereafter, he told me that after he had broken up with that 13-year-old girl back when he was in the Air Force, he hooked up with yet another 13-year-old girl; and, by then, he was in his twenties. He never really specified to me whether he had mistaken this second 13-year-old girl as being older than her actual age. My father insisted to me that he never had sex with either of these girls; but after I spoke about it with my mother not too long ago, it became obvious to us that he had a propensity to gravitate towards girls this young when he was in his twenties. I would call my father a lot of things. That is, he is selfish with his money, greedy, cantankerous, and very self-absorbed. However, I would never call him a sexual predator, because I know for a fact that he isn’t one.

  45. Steven Bruce says:

    I am attracted to 13-16 year old girls if they have the shape of a woman. Fear of getting caught at it is the only reason I haven’t acted on my desire. Women who think that’s sick simply don’t understand what it’s like to be a man. I could just as soon deny my thirst for water on a hot day as stop thinking about mounting young women if I’m horny.

  46. St_Julian says:

    I’m weighing in on this one more time and I want to ask a question of all you people who seem to advocate that it is OK to have sexual intercourse with little pre-teen girls and tweens or young teens. Would you so readily welcome the reality that some 40 year old sexually deviant dipshit slithered his way into YOUR 11, 12, or 13 year old daughter’s panties and gave her much pain by shoving himself inside her and bursting her hymen, thereby stretching her little vagina prematurely and tearing it? How would she stand that kind of trauma? Wouldn’t it be reasonable to say that she’d be forever changed on a physical and a mental scale? What is the prognosis for her positive recovery from such an experience? Now, would you want that for your own daughter, or niece? If the answer is NO, then why would you even think about doing it to someone else’s child? If your answer is YES, then pray that you are not caught doing it anywhere near where my kind of cop has jurisdiction!

    • andriodvageta says:

      Sounds to me by your overly graphic comment that you’re trying to cover up your REAL feelings on the matter. I think you do want to have sex with young girls…I mean…how the fuck did you find this article anyways you pervert? What were YOU Googling when you stumbled across this one article amidst a ocean of information on the internet?

      You want to have sex with teens…just admit it. Stop suppressing your feelings and desires because you feel weird about it. Embrace it and quit trying to make others feel like scumbags because they like the thought of nice tight pussy and tits.

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        Well, andriodvageta? I think the crux of the big picture here is that the heart does what it wants rather than what society expects it to do. The biggest mistake that American society makes is assuming that if an adolescent girl hooks up with a boy the same age as her, the relationship is going to turn into this storybook romance like those told in Harlequin novels; whereas if an adolescent girl falls in love with an adult man even as young as college age and he falls in love with her, a heinous sex crime is just waiting to happen no matter how sincere both the adolescent girl and the adult man are in their feelings for each other. The Duggars of “19 Kids And Counting” tried to promote this phony baloney doctrine of theirs in the form of all their boastful, gushy stories about how Michelle Duggar fell madly in love at the age of 14 years old with Jim Bob Duggar when he was just 15 years old and how their early “age-appropriate” romance that later turned into a marriage and a family was the moral backbone of the United States of America and possibly the entire world. However, finally, the cat came crawling right out of the bag earlier this year, and the world discovered that this couple wasn’t such an icon of wholesome perfection after learning that their oldest son, Josh Duggar, was anything but the proverbial goodie two-shoes that he and his parents presented him to be.

        Reality has it that same-age relationships between adolescent girls and adolescent boys can and do end in disaster, whereas there have existed adolescent girls as young 14 and 13 and even 12 who have become involved with significantly older men and have later married them and lived happily ever after with them. Whenever I hear about a 14-year-old girl dating a 22-year-old man or even a young girl between 13 and 15 years old marrying a man in his thirties, I don’t encourage these relationships. However, I don’t discourage them either. I just recognize that they do exist and that people shouldn’t necessarily form judgments about them, negative or positive, until they have all of their facts straight. I guess we also shouldn’t be mindless of St_Julian’s obvious suggestion that if a 40-plus-year-old man were to legally marry a 12-year-old girl today and such a couple were to walk around together in Central Park in Manhattan and the young wife was wearing a maternity gown, there would likely be people gawking at them with looks of shock and outrage. However, I would just tell that 40-plus-year-old man that if he feels threatened by others who obviously disapprove of his being with that young girl, then he might just wish to invest in buying himself a stun gun or a taser. I’d also tell him and his wife to avoid making any appearances on “The Steve Wilkos Show” at all costs. And, yes, if a group of vigilantes were to threaten his life at his residence because of his marriage to that young girl and he were to shoot and kill these vigilantes in self-defense, I would say that he acted within his rights. Piss on the family members and loved ones of those vigilantes that he offed.

        The English common law stipulates that if the parents provide legal approval, a girl can marry as young as 12 years old and a boy can marry as young as 14 years old. Taking everything I’ve read on this blog sheet and other similar ones into consideration, I say that this should be the law in every state of the United States of America. In a nutshell, I strongly feel that underage marriage should be kept legal in this respect here in the United States of America. If two people are profoundly in love with each other to such a degree that they cannot wait to act on those feelings and both individuals just happen to be on the opposite sides of the legal age line, then they should have some pathway in the law that allows them to make their sexual relationship completely legal before the younger partner in that relationship reaches the statutory age of consent. Kathleen Sebelius is against this sort of thing. Let’s be glad that her political career was ultimately destroyed in Washington before she had the opportunity to run for president of the United States of America.

      • Maxinius says:

        The whole point is–that as grownups we are SUPPOSED to suppress it, refute it, and DO NOT act on it! To answer your question about how I found this article was that I tract certain trends on YouTube. I sometimes put in gobble-de-gook references and see what I get back. One day I got back this video about this girl and her EMO lifestyle, and she mentioned Emma The Emo, so I googled that, and found this article. Happy?
        No, I don’t secretly yearn to have sex with young girls, and I certainly had my chance to do that many, many times. There are lots of underage girls who will approach a grown man and let him know that they would like to try something sexual. Yes, that has happened to me and NO, I did not take advantage of the situation. Granted, I have seen some very tantalizing teen girls in my time, but I always remembered my duty to society, God, and myself as a public servant. I never abused my public trust, and never would.

    • Subliminal Portal says:

      Okay, St_Julian. Your point is well taken, and it is only to be expected that you’re going to feel the way you do about this issue inasmuch as you used to be a police officer and, in all due likelihood, you mostly saw the dark side of adult-adolescent relationships. However, here is my argument and the argument of many. Our great nation, the United States of America, has an epidemic of adolescent boys ages 12 1/2 to 15 years old who pressure girls 11, 12, and 13 years old into sexual intercourse, get these girls pregnant, and then bail on them. The parents of these young boys usually feel it’s not their problem but rather the problem of the girl and her parents. Society does nothing about it. The law does nothing about it on either a civil or criminal level. To add insult to injury, these boys ruin these girls’ reputations among their peers and their lives, and these boys may end up doing this sort of thing to numerous girls from the time they are in middle school to the time they are in high school. Yet they get away with it, and our country continues to be the deadbeat teen capital of the world just as before. On the other hand, you have women like the 34-year-old woman described in this following online article who needlessly live in fear that their husbands’ lives will be threatened or their kids will be taunted and teased.>>>>Click onto http://www.al.com/specialreport/mobileregister/index.ssf?childbride9.html
      If you read this same article, you’ll see that this woman was afraid to reveal her identity, because she feared that people would not respect her marriage despite that she had been married to her husband for 20 years by the time this same online article had been published. Somehow I find it to be a double standard that this woman and her husband get treated like social outcasts, whereas adolescent boys 15 years old and younger who knock up preteen, tween, and younger teenage girls and then bail on them never seem to get any flak from society at all for their actions. When this woman and her husband got married back in 1983, she was 14 years old and her husband was 43 years old. Do you believe that that makes her husband an unconventional individual? If you do so, I won’t disagree with you. However, I can be sure that her husband is still a decent enough person that he would never go marching down the streets of New York City in a pedophile pride parade alongside weirdos like Jack McClellan and Phillip Greaves, figuratively speaking. Moreover, I would never sink so low as to refer to any of the kids that this man fathered with his wife as being rape babies, and I would certainly hope that you wouldn’t either.

      One of our American presidential candidates, Dr. Ben Carson, even admitted at one of the nationally televised debates that his mother got married at the age of 13 years old. If you look up that information online, you’ll even notice that she married a 28-year-old man rather than a 15 or 16-year-old boy. The marriage started out beautifully, and it probably would have lasted forever if Dr. Ben Carson’s father had steered clear of bigamy. In any event, I can be most assured that Dr. Ben Carson would never appreciate anyone saying that his parents’ marriage was a legalized form of pedophilia. Fact has it that it wasn’t.

      I’m no different than you are in a sense that I do recognize that there are relationships between adolescent girls and adult men that are so toxic and destructive that they should never exist in the first place. However, the problem I am having here is that I simply cannot buy into the Puritanical establishment’s biased perspective that all adult-adolescent relationships are always sexually exploitative and wrong and that all adolescent boys can do no wrong to girls in the middle school and high school age range. That school of thought simply just doesn’t sit well with me, and it likely doesn’t sit well with a lot of people who have commented on this blog sheet.

  47. St_Julian says:

    Well, Subliminal Portal, you have made a point worth making, and I agree that every so often, when the perp is caught, it wasn’t the girl’s intent that he be prosecuted because for whatever reason she was into the relationship. That doesn’t make it right. I predict that one day, these relationships will be acceptable under the law, and I also believe that even incest might one day be acceptable. I mean, why not? We have accepted same-sex marriage, atheism, the banning of prayer from schools, the removal of God’s Ten Commandment Law from public places, and although there is no law banning the mention of God in public, there might as well be because most Christians won’t discuss the bible unless they are at home, in church, or at a religious gathering. It is coming, and I think it will be a sad day when it all does come.

    I agree that there are some girls 12 and older who are ready for the sexual experience, but there are so many others, more in fact, who are not. Why, I’ve met grown women who weren’t ready for it! It just seems like such a miscarriage of good intent for grown men to lust after such young girls when there are so many willing grown women available for them. I know too that the men who have such lusts are not limited to the poor or middle classes, but especially extends up into the classes of elite men and women who can afford to satisfy their need for young flesh by throwing money at the kids and their parents. No, I’m not naïve enough to believe it doesn’t happen. We have busted a few fat cats who thought they were impervious to the laws. Unfortunately in those days, (70s, early 80’s) they mostly only got a slap on the wrist, while some poor bastard who got drunk and screwed his own daughter got 30 years. I’m sorry, but I have seen what these relationships can do to young girls, even when they thought it was what they wanted at first. I have seen girls with so much potential for being solid citizens with plenty to offer society get their lives wrecked by these predatory males. By the same token, I have seen young girls who took to that life like a duck to water. But grown men are supposed to know better and be able to control themselves better. Perhaps in view of the reality of the situation the laws should be changed sooner rather than later. However, they have not been changed yet, which makes it a crime for grown men to have sexual relations with underage girls, and therefore, they should be prosecuted when caught. Until the laws catch up with society perverseness, they must still be enforced. I guess my biggest problem when I was still wearing the badge was that I was too much of a straight shooter. I had to constantly watch my own back because I did not tolerate corruption of any sort. That no-holes-barred straight shooting, protect and serve attitude sort of put a target on my back. There are many, many crooked, perverse cops wearing badges. I’m proud to say that I never did sully the good name of the boys in blue by being on the wrong side of the law. The truth is though, that good reputation and $5.00 might get me a cup of coffee.

    • Subliminal Portal says:

      St_Julian? I appreciate the fact that you and I have been able to have this online conversation on a civilized level like too mature human beings. Whenever I am on YouTube or any other online site that involves discussion threads, I sometimes find people getting too psyched up about others disagreeing with them, especially when the topic of conversation is one of a controversial nature. You made some very interesting points in your recent reply to me. And even though I don’t completely agree with you on them, I don’t completely disagree with you on them either.

      Your point about the current law outlawing sexual relations between adult men and adolescent girls in most state jurisdictions of the United States of America, depending upon the statutory age of consent, is well-taken. However, even at that, I still strongly feel that a reasonable distinction should be made between what is reckless criminality and what is harmless civil disobedience in view of these same laws. The point that you made about the “fat cats” that you busted brought this one disturbing news story to mind that I had seen on the “ABC Evening News” several years ago. It was about this extremely rich man who had traveled to the Philippines and did the most unconscionable thing that anyone of wealth and power could have done. He zeroed in on this one poor family that had a 7-year-old daughter that he lusted after. I couldn’t tell how old he was from the picture of him that they showed on the TV screen, but the fact that he was a grown man and wealthy clearly indicated that his intentions for this little girl were definitely not honorable. He offered to continue to pay this little girl’s parents’ mortgage in exchange for their agreement that they would raise this little girl and allow for him to take her virginity once she got her first menstrual period. Eventually, this girl became pregnant and gave birth to this man’s baby when she was 14 years old. Shortly thereafter, this rich man died. Then this young girl and her parents hired an attorney to go after this rich man’s family estate so that the young girl’s baby would be well-provided for. The rich man’s family contested the legal proceedings and hired this rich man’s attorney to do so. When a news reporter interviewed the rich man’s attorney and recapitulated the entire story to him, the attorney made this bitter look and said, “None of those girls are ever virgins!” As you can see, the term “male chauvinist” would have been way too nice of a word to describe this lawyer. To make a long story short, this news story really creeped me out to the point that it made my skin crawl. It was no secret that this rich man was a dangerous sexual predator; and if he had still been alive after this young girl he sexually abused had become pregnant with his baby, I would have been more than happy to have seen the law come down upon him like a ton of bricks. Therefore, as you can see, in a lot of ways, I am no different than you are; and the above described situation is a clearly a case of reckless criminality that would have merited harsh remedial action to the fullest extent of the law. What this rich man did was wrong, and there is no way he could not have known it.

      Now, on the other hand, as difficult as you may find this to believe, I have come across true stories about situations in which the age of consent laws got broken that amount to nothing more than cases of harmless civil disobedience. On this one website that contains an article regarding “statutory rape” and the laws that address it, there was this one 18-year-old girl named Bethany who posted a description of a situation from five years earlier in which her friend named Caroline hooked up with a 26-year-old man shortly before this Caroline turned 13 years old. This was Caroline’s first serious relationship, and this young man was the one to whom she lost her virginity. This Caroline kept this relationship a secret from people she didn’t wish to know about it. When she was 15 years old, she became pregnant with her boyfriend’s baby, who by then would have been 28 years old. She obviously didn’t wish to abort the baby, and she wanted to keep it. Therefore, she arranged with a male friend of hers named Robert, who was the same age as her, to pose as the baby’s father, because, hey, even you as a former police officer have to know that it is nearly impossible to slap a teenage boy younger than 18 years old with a statutory rape conviction for having sexual relations with a girl of the same age. In other words, Caroline’s boyfriend used Robert as a bulletproof vest against a possible statutory rape trial. By the time Bethany had posted this story of hers online, Caroline was 18 years old and her boyfriend was 31 years old, and Caroline and her older boyfriend were still together and expecting their second child. Bethany stressed that adolescents will find such creative ways to circumvent the age of consent laws inasmuch as they don’t see these laws acting in their best interests. The irony of this story that Bethany posted was that it was in response to an online article supporting tougher age of consent laws and higher ages of consent here in the United States of America.>>>>Click onto http://www.gurl.com/2013/07/31/what-is-statutory-rape-age-difference-in-relationship/

      My exact thoughts about Bethany’s story is that her friend, Caroline, felt that she needed to do what she had to do in order to steer her older boyfriend clear of the kind of indignities described in this following online article.>>>Click onto https://www.reddit.com/r/confession/comments/1kdu1t/i_am_a_sex_offender_who_is_abused_and_harassed/

      I don’t encourage people to break the law; but somehow I don’t believe that Caroline would have gone to great lengths to protect her older boyfriend from a needless statutory rape rap, if she had actually been a victim of sexual exploitation or sexual abuse as some people may believe. She eventually had a baby in the picture. I’m not saying that becoming pregnant at 15 years old was a good thing. However, she wanted her older boyfriend to be in their child’s life, and she did what she felt she had to do. I imagine this older boyfriend will feel indebted to Robert for the rest of his life for saving him from a lifetime of needless humiliation and undue scrutiny by the criminal justice system. I’m also not embarrassed to say that it is situations like these that cause me to be a firm believer in jury nullification for “statutory rape” cases like this one that amount to nothing more than just harmless civil disobedience. That is, I believe that jurors do have the right to vote “not guilty” in a “statutory rape” trial if they feel that justice won’t be served and that the alleged victim’s best interests are not being served either in any way, shape, or form, even if the alleged perpetrator actually violated the law.

      Now I know you’re probably asking why in the world would a 26-year-old man have fallen in love with a 12-to-13-year-old girl in the first place. I cannot really speculate on what caused this man to gravitate towards this young girl, because I don’t have enough information from the story that Bethany posted on the above described website. I will say that the Millennial Generation is among the most complex out of all the generations. Yeah, I know that you believe that it is an adult man’s duly obligation to say no to a girl that young in such situations. However, from a bird’s eye view, the one-size-fits-all standard that you speak of is becoming less and less conducive to the diametrically different set of circumstances that each adult man falls into as he enters into his twenties and on into his thirties nowadays. It could have very well been that this 26-year-old man had never had a girlfriend before in his life, and he just couldn’t relate to women his own age. Therefore, Caroline was like that one teenage girlfriend he wished he had known when he was an adolescent himself. Because of the charisma-oriented society and caste system that has become a regular part of the American culture, it is no mystery why so many adult men feel that they have been cheated out of their adolescent years and, therefore, become easily enamored with an adolescent girl who shows them the kind of attention that they wished they had gotten from a girl that age when they themselves were in middle school or high school. A loveless relationship with a woman their own age they cannot relate to or a relationship with nobody at all is just simply not good enough for them. The heart does what it wants rather than what society wants it to do. It’s like I have said in other posts of mine on this blog sheet, the American culture caters mainly to prom kings and prima donna men who get the female attention they want from an early age on; and these big shots are lucky that they will never have to make the difficult choices that less fortunate men in that area of life will have to make and perhaps someday end up living the lonely life of a 60-plus-year-old male virgin or the degrading life of someone on the sex offender registry or behind bars OR the depressing life of a man trapped in a marriage with a woman his own age for whom he has no feelings. Every young boy cannot grow up to be like Jim Bob Duggar of “19 Kids And Counting,” and Jim Bob Duggar and his family is just an illusion of what the Puritanical Establishment idealizes people should be like rather than a realistic viewpoint of what the American people are all about.

    • Subliminal Portal says:

      St_Julian? Sorry that my reply to your last post was duplicated more than once. For some reason or another, when I kept trying to post my reply to you, nothing would show up on this blog sheet. I even tried to post my reply in two different segments. Oh, boy. I wish there were a delete feature on this blog sheet so that I wouldn’t feel so guilty of having cluttered it up with the exact same reply. In any event, at least I got my reply finally posted. Even though one time previously I had to post the same thing over and over again at least five different times just to get it to appear on this blog sheet, I somehow suspected that something like this could also happen. Oh, well, Emma the Emmo will probably see the duplicated replies and erase them and leave the first reply I made to your most recent post.

    • Subliminal Portal says:

      Nataliya Kochergova? Thank you for responding. I was glad to hear from you. Yeah, I would like for you to delete the entries I posted on this blog sheet for the following dates and times:
      December 7, 2015 at 7:45 a.m.
      December 7, 2015 at 7:34 a.m.
      December 7, 2015 at 7:50 a.m.
      December 7, 2015 at 7:52 a.m.
      December 7, 2015 at 7:54 a.m.

      Go ahead and leave the entry I posted on this blog sheet for December 7, 2015 at 7:02 a.m., because that was the first time that I had posted that specific opinion of mine to respond to St_Julian and that is the one that I wish to remain here on this blog sheet for St_Julian and others to see. Thank you for your assistance.

  48. Zoe Winslow says:

    Men pursue younger women for the power imbalance, not because he is stimulated by her. Intentionally developing relationships with women or girls considerably younger than oneself is a very obvious sign of an abuser. It is not normal for a grown man to be attracted to a 12 year old adolescent because even if she is by definition fertile, the age at which a woman can healthily birth a child is much closer to 30. A 12 year old girls’ body is not developed enough for childbirth; it could seriously hurt her. Not to mention the emotional damage and confusion that a pubescent girl could carry her entire life if she were to have a relationship with a grown man.

    • Subliminal Portal says:

      Zoe? I mean no disrespect. However, as much as it pains me to say this to you, the word “normal” has become arbitrary in its usage in recent years in view of all the public hysteria over adult men zeroing in on adolescent girls, so to speak. Particularly by law-enforcement officials and mental health professionals here in the United States of America. Your opinion adheres closely to the viewpoint of the Puritanical establishment, which could be defined in the American culture as the winning side. However, I always say that it’s so much easier to be on the winning side than to question its integrity. When French Canadian singer Celine Dion was 12 years old, she fell in love with Rene Angelil, who was at the time in his late thirties. To this very day, people continue to question how soon did he become responsive to Celine Dion’s flirtations and expressions of romantic interest in him. I’ve read hateful comments that people have posted on Facebook and other blog sheets, insisting that he somehow groomed her from an early age on and then brainwashed her into becoming his sex object. My response to such comments is “Bullshit!” Pardon my French. Celine Dion is now in her forties, and this debate still continues on to this very day. However, let’s assume just for the sake of argument that Rene Angelil did become responsive to Celine Dion’s flirtations and expressions of romantic interest shortly after he met her when she was still 12 years old. Celine Dion and Rene Angelil are now happily married and raising 3 wonderful kids. If you follow news about them, you’ll even agree that they’re a more down-to-Earth family than the Duggars of “19 Kids And Counting.” (And Michelle Duggar and Jim Bod Duggar are high school sweethearts. Yuck!) Therefore, wouldn’t these facts tend to prove that this whole question of whether non-exploitative relationships between adolescent girls and adult men can exist is not as black and white as American society obviously believes it to be? When I saw the docudrama movie about Celine Dion and saw the scene where she was in her early twenties and she broke into tears when an interviewer asked her about her love life and she was too afraid to say anything about her relationship with Rene Angelil because of their age difference and the biased way Americans think, I nearly felt as though I was going to break into tears myself. She and Rene Angelil should not have had to live that way at the offset of their relationship. And, no, none of Celine Dion’s kids have birth defects, even though Rene Angelil was well over 45 years old when they were born. It’s as though American society molds its customs, social conventions, and laws around all the prom kings and prima donna men of the world and leaves nothing for the little guys who might just happen to be late in the game, figuratively speaking. I’m not saying that toxic and destructive relationships between adolescent girls (12 and older) and adult men don’t exist. They do. However, what I have found throughout my life is that many adult men who fall in love with adolescent girls and later marry them do so not because they are abusers and wish to take advantage of a “power imbalance.” Many of these men perhaps may have been wrongfully cheated out of their earlier youth one way or another, and these adolescent girls give them a second chance to experience the beauty of a first-love-style relationship that they missed out on as adolescent boys. This is hard for me to explain this to you, because you’re a woman, Zoe, and I guess it’s only feminine instinct for you to think the worst of these men. However, if the day comes that you someday have a son and he falls into these circumstances I described to you when he is in his twenties, you will not want people passing judgment on him the same way that too many of these men get wrongfully judged.

  49. James says:

    This is partly true, however, those people would be called hebephilia. much like pedophilia (which means an adult who is attracted to a prepubescent male and/or female). hebephilia (which is a subcategory of pedophila) is an adult who prefers 11-14 year olds.

    • James says:

      Sorry the term is hebephilia but they would be called hebephiliacs

      • Mr.Robot says:

        Sorry the term is hebephilia but they would be called hebephiliacs. I would know, I am a pedophile and I fall under all pedophile classifications of preference. Though I prefer females starting from newborns and ending around 16 years of age, my primary focus is 2-9. I should also clarify that most pedophiles never harm a child (touch/have sex with). I fall under this group of pedophiles. Likewise, I also do not watch porn, I have a strict moral code which is basically No: Internet CP, Touching/getting touched, Pictures, contact. I only look.

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        Sorry about the typographical errors in my first post, James. I redid the post and corrected those typographical errors. I hope Emma catches and doesn’t delete the wrong one.

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        James? I would also like to add that Dr. Ray Blanchard was the mastermind of that same so-called research study that Dr. James Cantor took part in in which they made efforts to expand the definition of pedophilia in the “Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders.” The so-called research study was actually conducted and authored in 2008, but the American Psychiatric Association was not at all impressed with it and rejected it when Dr. Blanchard and Dr. Cantor presented it to them when the “Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders” was in the process of being updated several years ago. Here is the full story behind it.>>>Click onto https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ray_Blanchard
        Dr. Blanchard has also been cited as taking part in unorthodox practices in the mental health profession. In other words, the man is a charlatan.

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        Mr. Robot? You claim that you “fall under all pedophile classifications of preference” going up to 16 years of age? I mean no disrespect; but just because you are attracted to 14, 15, and 16-year-old girls doesn’t mean that every man over 21 years old who falls in love with a teenage girl is any kind of pedophile. You could have a preference ranging from female newborns to women in their mid-thirties, and that would not make adult men pedophiles for being attracted to women in their early thirties. If you read the “Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders,” you’ll find that what ultimately identifies a man as being a pedophile is whether he is sexually attracted to pre-pubescent children. It doesn’t matter if he hangs out at the old folks home too, flirting with every old lady he comes in contact with. That is, he could be a gerontophile and a pedophile at the same time. Just because he is one doesn’t necessarily mean he is the other and vice versa. I just thought I’d make that one contribution to this discussion thread.

    • Subliminal Portal says:

      James? You say that hebephilia is a subcategory of pedophilia? That was actually an argument that Dr. James Cantor presented to the American Psychiatric Association two years ago when the “Diagnostic And Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders” was being updated. However, they rejected his argument that hebephilia was a subcategory of pedophilia, because they were suspicious that special interests groups were in league with him to promote this agenda for profitable reasons. If you look into Dr. Cantor’s background, he is not the most ethical mental health profession in the industry, considering that he came up with this nonsense that claimed that left-handed people were more like to be pedophiles than right-handed people, which is half the planet. It is also hard to envision that he could even understand how the male heterosexual mind works when he, in fact, is gay. (Not that I’m a homophobic person, because I’m not.)

      Instead of becoming too enmeshed in the science behind all of this, why don’t we look at the American pop culture at large? Jack McClellan announced to the entire world that he was a self-proclaimed pedophile in 2008. Philip Greaves published a controversial book promoting pedophilia shortly thereafter, making it no secret that he was a pedophile sympathizer, if not a pedophile. However, here’s the thing. Actor Don Johnson was 22 years old and Melanie Griffith was in her early teens when they both hooked up together and eventually married. Oliver Lynn was in his twenties when he married country music singer Loretta Lynn, who was in her early teens at the time. French Canadian singer Celine Dion at the age of 12 fell in love with Rene Angelil, who was in his late thirties at the time. There continues to be an uncertainty as to whether he was in love with her that far back in time or if he fell in love with her later on, but Celine Dion and Rene Angelil eventually married in any event. Billy Wyman of the Rolling Stones was 47 years old and model Mandy Smith was 13 years old when they began dating, and eventually they married not too long thereafter. What Don Johnson, Oliver Lynn, Billy Wyman, and Rene Angelil all have in common is that they have never consorted with individuals like Jack McClellan and Philip Greaves, because they would likely never wish to be associated with people like them. (Yeah, I understand that Oliver Lynn died back in 1996, but you get the picture). They don’t want to be viewed or judged in the same manner as these people. And who can really blame them? Pedophile hysteria is everywhere. And anyone who gets labeled as a hebephile would likely prefer that such a label be eliminated and that society just labels them as normal.

      The debate over whether or not an adult male who takes a romantic, or even sexual, interest in a pubescent and adolescent girl has identical internal wiring in his head as an adult man who is sexually attracted to little girls as young as 3 years old like Jack McClellan falls within the same intensity level of discord as the debate over whether psychics get their extrasensory abilities from a scientific phenomenon or from the Prince of Darkness himself. Educated people would claim that psychics get their abilities from a scientific phenomenon, whereas religious fanatics would believe that they get their abilities from the devil. The same with the debate over what happens to suicides after they die. Even though people have been hypnotized and have stated that they had committed suicide in a previous life and were reincarnated, Christian fundamentalists insist that each and every suicide victim is burning in Hell at this very minute.

      The United States of America has gone through this sort of thing during at least three different time periods in our history. First, it was the Salem witch trial in the 1600s. Innocent people were often burned at the stake on accusations of witchcraft. Then it was the Red Scare in the 1950s when Congressman Joe McCarthy was placing everyone on the commie list who he suspected was cooperating with the Soviets, and these individuals found it hard to get employment or even a place to live because of it. Now it’s the Pedophile Panic, which Dr. Judith Levine warned Americans about back in 2002 in her controversial book titled “Harmful to Minors; the Perils of Protecting Children from Sex.” Her position was to support law-enforcement’s efforts to incarcerate dangerous child molesters and sexual predators, but, at the same time, she was looking to promote understanding among the public at large that the benign psychological forces that may be at work to cause adolescent boys to become attracted to pubescent and adolescent girls may also be the same ones causing men in their twenties and older to have the same types of attraction to girls in that age group rather than anything having to do with pedophilia. A recent film titled “Are All Men Pedophiles?” even talked about that observation among various experts. In a nutshell, hebephilia would appear to be a subcategory of “normal” or rather just a label that should be removed from the English language altogether.

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        James? You say that hebephilia is a subcategory of pedophilia? That was actually an argument that Dr. James Cantor presented to the American Psychiatric Association two years ago when the “Diagnostic And Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders” was being updated. However, they rejected his argument that hebephilia was a subcategory of pedophilia, because they were suspicious that special interests groups were in league with him to promote this agenda for profitable reasons. If you look into Dr. Cantor’s background, he is not the most ethical mental health professional in the industry, considering that he came up with this nonsense that claimed that left-handed people were more likely to be pedophiles than right-handed people, which is half the planet. It is also hard to envision that he could even understand how the male heterosexual mind works when he, in fact, is gay. (Not that I’m a homophobic person, because I’m not.)

        Instead of becoming too enmeshed in the science behind all of this, why don’t we look at the American pop culture at large? Jack McClellan announced to the entire world that he was a self-proclaimed pedophile in 2008. Philip Greaves published a controversial book promoting pedophilia shortly thereafter, making it no secret that he was a pedophile sympathizer, if not a pedophile. However, here’s the thing. Actor Don Johnson was 22 years old and Melanie Griffith was in her early teens when they both hooked up together and eventually married. Oliver Lynn was in his twenties when he married country music singer Loretta Lynn, who was in her early teens at the time. French Canadian singer Celine Dion at the age of 12 fell in love with Rene Angelil, who was in his late thirties at the time. There continues to be an uncertainty as to whether he was in love with her that far back in time or if he fell in love with her later on, but Celine Dion and Rene Angelil eventually married in any event. Billy Wyman of the Rolling Stones was 47 years old and model Mandy Smith was 13 years old when they began dating, and eventually they married not too long thereafter. What Don Johnson, Oliver Lynn, Billy Wyman, and Rene Angelil all have in common is that they have never consorted with individuals like Jack McClellan and Philip Greaves, because they would likely never wish to be associated with people like them. (Yeah, I understand that Oliver Lynn died back in 1996, but you get the picture). They don’t want to be viewed or judged in the same manner as these people. And who can really blame them? Pedophile hysteria is everywhere. And anyone who gets labeled as a hebephile would likely prefer that such a label be eliminated and that society just labels them as normal.

        The debate over whether or not an adult male who takes a romantic, or even sexual, interest in a pubescent and adolescent girl has identical internal wiring in his head as an adult man who is sexually attracted to little girls as young as 3 years old like Jack McClellan falls within the same intensity level of discord as the debate over whether psychics get their extrasensory abilities from a scientific phenomenon or from the Prince of Darkness himself. Educated people would claim that psychics get their abilities from a scientific phenomenon, whereas religious fanatics would believe that they get their abilities from the devil. The same with the debate over what happens to suicides after they die. Even though people have been hypnotized and have stated that they had committed suicide in a previous life and were reincarnated, Christian fundamentalists insist that each and every suicide victim is burning in Hell at this very minute.

        The United States of America has gone through this sort of thing during at least three different time periods in our history. First, it was the Salem witch trials in the 1600s. Innocent people were often burned at the stake on accusations of witchcraft. Then it was the Red Scare in the 1950s when Congressman Joe McCarthy was placing everyone on the commie list who he suspected was cooperating with the Soviets, and these individuals found it hard to get employment or even a place to live because of it. Now it’s the Pedophile Panic, which Dr. Judith Levine warned Americans about back in 2002 in her controversial book titled “Harmful to Minors; the Perils of Protecting Children from Sex.” Her position was to support law-enforcement’s efforts to incarcerate dangerous child molesters and sexual predators, but, at the same time, she was looking to promote understanding among the public at large that the benign psychological forces that are at work to cause adolescent boys to become attracted to pubescent and adolescent girls may also be the same ones causing men in their twenties and older to have the same types of attraction to girls in that age group rather than anything having to do with pedophilia or any kind of paraphilia. A recent film titled “Are All Men Pedophiles?” even talked about that observation among various experts. In a nutshell, hebephilia would appear to be a subcategory of “normal” or rather just a label that should be removed from the English language altogether. Unlike pedophilia, it is not a paraphilia.

  50. Maxinius says:

    Subliminal Portal: Greetings to you. It has been a while. Sorry to take so long getting to this, but life and duty calls.

    I appreciate your acknowledgement of the civility of our conversation. Now-a-days, it is rather rare to discuss politics, religion, or controversial situations without one party of the other becoming incensed. You and I are like spectators watching the same game from opposite sides of the same stadium. We both see from different angles; which is not a bad thing actually. There are pros and cons from both angles, and we each may learn something from the other, or at least get fresh ideas to ponder.

    Speaking of YouTube: I mentioned before that I go there to track certain trends. Mostly my observations in YouTube have to do with tracking provocative videos uploaded by preteens as well as young teens, and analyzing the inappropriate responses in the comments section from potential pedophiles and other sex offenders. As you probably know, there is no lack of such videos on YouTube. In fact, there have been a few girls between eleven and thirteen who took their channels down because of the lude comments they got from many of the males who watched them.

    I have a theory of sorts. Some of the girls (and the occasional boy) who post these provocative dance and gymnastics videos on YouTude either have gone missing, or will go missing, because their parents allow(ed) them to advertise themselves to predators so freely on this particular social media, and these kids put targets on their own backs. Imagine some sinfully rich, morally bankrupt man (or woman) who likes young girls or boys is sitting somewhere in the world with more money than God, and a willingness to spend it freely for some girl or boy he (or she) sees on a YouTube video (and there are some very beautiful and one of a kind girls and boys making these provocative vids). He (or she) decides they must have the child in question, so he (or she) lets it be known to the “right” party that a team is needed to procure this treasure for him or her. There are always those who will respond to this type of request and negotiate a price for their services. The bad guys would never have known the girl or boy existed if their video had not been placed on YouTube. I’m sure you are smiling and saying to yourself, “What a vivid stretch of the imagination!” And I do understand it if you are saying that, I do. However, that scenario is not as far fetched as it may seem. We have found that in the world of organized crime, which includes human trafficking and pedophilia, they are always on the look out for the next opportunity to make a fortune, and always looking for the next great find, especially in female flesh. That’s what those kinds of people do, and they cater to people with too much money, no morals, and little or no conscience. I can’t say that I know anyone who would want their beautiful little niece or daughter, cousin or even a friend’s relative to end up a victim of such crime.

    Now, back to the conversation. Yes, the age of consent laws get violated ALL the time by different people. Those who have money and power usually get away with violating it and if they get anything at all, it’s like a slap on the hand. It’s primarily the poor sods who are without means, and equally without dignity or honor, who go to prison for years behind these violations. When I was living in England in the mid 80s, there was a case that one of my British counterparts worked concerning a thirteen year old girl and a sixty four year old man who lived next door. The poor chap got busted when the parents caught him doing the do with their young daughter. The fellow got four years in prison, and the girl vowed her love for the old fellow. She rebelled against her parents for having him put away, and she demanded and got visitation rights to go see him twice a week for the duration of his incarceration. When he was released, she was old enough to marry, and they got married. So yes, it was only seen as a crime by the authorities and the general public. I get that. I get why Caroline did what she did to protect her older boyfriend in the relationship you described. My only question is why did the boyfriend not marry Caroline? Instead, it seems he just kept getting her pregnant as a girlfriend. After her sacrifice to save his backside, the least he could have done was take her to the altar and do it right.

    I believe that the last thing we need in this country now are any form of relaxed age of consent laws. Girls and boys, men and women, are making enough mistakes where sex is concerned without inviting more. I have no doubt that sometime in the future; new laws will be passed condoning sexual unions between adults and children. Once there would have been lynchings and tar and feather parties if two men had mentioned getting married to each other, but now it is becoming a common thing. Many of us may not like it, but it has become a part of our social tradition through the adoption of laws concerning the practice. I also believe that given enough time, even incest will become a matter of course through relaxation of the laws. All these things may be seen as progress, but to where? To what end? These are things that will not do our society or our culture any good at all. They only facilitate the inevitable fall of society.

    You stated: “However, from a bird’s eye view, the one-size-fits-all standard is becoming less and less conducive to the diametrically different set of circumstances that each adult man falls into as he enters into his twenties and on into his thirties.” I respectfully disagree with that line of thought. The truth is, the average young men of today are simply just much, much weaker in character and lacking in honor than young men of recent and past generations. The once great institution of responsible parenting has changed so much and given too much ground to the intelligentsia surrounding the psychology of child rearing. Therefore, current generations lack the moral stability seen in recent ones. There are many exceptions to this rule, but for the most part, it is true.

    You further state that, “It could have very well been that this 26-year old man had never had a girlfriend before in his life, and he just couldn’t relate to women his own age. Therefore, Caroline was like that one teenage girlfriend he wished he had known when he was an adolescent himself.”

    That seems to be pure speculation on your part, but I am willing to give you the benefit of the doubt. But, I seriously doubt that he never had a girlfriend before, and I seriously doubt that he could not relate to women his age. I rather believe that he chose not to relate to women his own age for whatever reason. He chose to go against the rule of law and be with a 12 year old. I think he knew full well what he was doing and that it was a criminal act under current laws. Although I don’t know his history, I would be willing to bet that Caroline was only one of at least several underage girl he had experienced. And from my point of view, after he got her pregnant, he knew he would be prosecuted, so he stood back, and like the coward that he is, he allowed Caroline to suffer the humiliation and anguish of her predicament by implicating an innocent friend who helped her live her little lie while the guilty party skated out of shouldering his own responsibility. Of course, it was her choice to protect him and hopefully, her friend’s choice to help her do it. Sorry, but I am of the opinion that in the long run, the truth is better than a lie, even if it hurts you. Caroline may believe she was helping the 26 year old, but in truth, I don’t see how she can put trust in a man who let her shoulder such a heavy burden just to save his own ass because she thought she was in love with him. As she matures into a sensible woman, (if she does), she will realize that this guy took advantage of her and then let her down when she needed him most. Why, he didn’t even think enough of her to put a ring on her finger before getting her pregnant again after she came of age! The true irony of it all is that this relationship probably will not last, and one day Caroline will find herself, asking herself, “What the hell was I thinking?”

    You stated also that “The heart does what it wants rather than what society wants it to do.”

    I think a truer statement is, “The heart does what it wants rather than what it knows to be the right thing to do.” Any heart that does what it wants irregardless of the consequences is rather a careless and uncaring one, don’t you think?

    If there are 60 plus year old male virgins, they made themselves. If they are virgins at 60 it is because they lacked what it took to get deflowered and they cannot blame society for being 60, lonely, and still a virgin.

    Likewise, convicted sex offenders chose to do what they did for their own reasons. They knew what they did was a crime, and they chose to do it anyway. They are reaping what they sowed.

    Those men and women supposedly “trapped” in loveless marriages choose to be there. They made their own mistakes and circumstances. They can leave any time they want to.

    It’s not a crime to be a 60 year old adult virgin. It’s not a crime for an adult to live in or leave a loveless marriage. It IS a crime for adults to have sexual relationships with underage children and get caught. I stress the “getting caught” part; I am not heartless.

    If you know an item has a high cost and you feel you must have that item, then you should be prepared to pay the cost for that item.

    Likewise, if you are an adult, and you know sex with underage children is a crime, then you should be honorable enough not to commit the crime in the first place. But, if you choose to perpetrate the crime and you are caught, you should expect, and be prepared, to suffer the consequences of your actions under the law. I hate sounding like a broken record, but I took a vow to uphold the laws of the land. If one day incest and pedophilia are allowed by law, I hope I will be honorable enough to enforce those laws too, even if I don’t think they are right.

    HONOR IS A GIFT WHICH A MAN GIVES TO HIMSELF

  51. jules says:

    Well I’ll be honest I’m 21 I won’t date lower then 16 or 17 for one that’s legal age in florida second most women are immature or lie about there age to Get with a older guy.

  52. Eli Swerv says:

    Some people imply Mother Nature made some big genetic mistake-that we shouldn’t grow genitals until we are 18. Culture says 18 now, and genetics say 12. Those who think she made a genetic deformity out of the human race have a bad case of self esteem towards who we are as a species. We are not a mistake, puberty is perfect where it’s at. 12 year girls are beautiful and sexy.

    Yes, fertility is hard wired, so we naturally would have the desire to mate with a female who could create more offspring than an an older woman who is closer to menopause. Getting together younger has benefits, because it decreases the likelihood of separation, unless you are brainwashed with serial-monogamy culture (many are) and are not in touch with your personality and had to recognize compatible types. A younger woman is less likely to have had women, she has slender hips and smaller breasts, and this is attractive because if a woman already has children those children will take away attention and care from any offspring a man may choose to have with her. Slim and flat chests win.

  53. StJulian says:

    What about the young girl? Does it matter what she wants, or DOESN’T want? Have we become a society so immorally engrossed in what we CAN do, that we seldom or never stop to think whether we SHOULD DO IT OR NOT? Twelve year old girls and boys are not ready for parenthood or marriage, so the laws that are in place are there for their protection. I agree, some of them are hot and sexy looking physically, but they are not where they should be emotionally yet. Grown men should give them a break.

  54. melanie says:

    GO DIE IN FIRE! PEOPLE LIKE YOU SHOULD NOT BE A LIVE. I really hate doing this but you people make me sick. You guys know fully well that girls at 12,13,14 years old are still growing and developing physical, mentally and emotionally.

    • William Donnie White says:

      Well said!!!!i have friends that think the olson twins are hot or rudy from the cosby show.but i cant get past the fact that it was little rudy and Michelle. I look and say look how big and grown they got not look how sexy they became!! I cant get past the babies they were.

  55. William Donnie White says:

    Thats horrible!!!! Guys looking at 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 girls as sexy.they’re babies still.they need to be loved,protected and looked after as a child!! No as a possible future mate.if a guy is looking at a young girl in any way sexually, he’s a pedofiler (spell check) waiting to strike!!! And shame on this article saying thats fine and normal. Shame shame shame.

  56. William Donnie White says:

    Any one who agrees with this article is either a predator or a potential soon to be predator.and if you agree with this than save yourself some time and pain and go to the sheriff office and register yourself because your neighbors with young kids need to know.and please DONT act on your sick thoughts.im sure all the convicted rapists first had thoughts not yet acted on.also please remember that these babies are our future let there mind mature properly so they can become great for the future.please also keep in mind that fathers like me will kill an adult who sexually seek my babies and id probably kill you on your thoughts alone.sickos its not normal.im so disgusted with this article

    • Subliminal Portal says:

      Okay, William. I’m not going to agree with you, but I’m not going to disagree with you either. I recognize that there are going to be both pros and cons to this same issue; and if you take the side of the cons instead of the pros, I must respect your viewpoint. However, this is what I cannot figure out. Whenever the subject comes up of whether movie director Roman Polanski should be granted amnesty back into the United States of America as opposed to his being extradited to face punishment, all these old ladies come out and rant and rave on the radio and on television about how this man should be castrated, shot, and even hanged. I’m not mindless as to why people would hate this man, because, after all, what he did back in 1977 is not something that people in the American culture are going to take lightly, to say the least. However, at the same time, many of these same angry old ladies want Hillary Clinton elected as the next president of the United States of America. Now how much sense does that make? If you surf around the Internet, you will find numerous online articles about how Hillary Clinton acted as the criminal defense attorney to two thugs who brutally raped and put a 12-year-old girl into a coma back in 1975. Hillary Clinton got one of them completely off the hook and the other one a sentence that amounted to nothing more than just a slap on the wrist. Hillary Clinton raked this young girl over the coals in cross-examination during the criminal trial back in 1975. Then the young girl attempted to commit suicide at the age of 13 because of the trauma she suffered from both the brutal rape and the trial, thanks to Hillary Clinton. This girl became sterile as a result of the rape. She is now in her fifties and has gone through numerous institutions because of drug addiction and mental problems as a result of what was done to her. She is not married, and she will never have kids because of her ordeal back in 1975.

      I’m not trying to play down what Roman Polanski did to Samantha Gailey-Geimer back in 1977. It is clear that he did cross a boundary that he should not have, because she did say no to him and he did give her booze and quaaludes. However, here is the thing. Samantha Gailey-Geimer has said in television interviews that what Roman Polanski did to her back in 1977 was not as bad as people think and that she just wants to move on with her life rather than the criminal justice system drag the question of his return to the United States of America out forever. On the other hand, the 12-year-old rape victim of the two thugs that Hillary Clinton defended back in 1975 suffers to this very day, and she has begged people not to vote for Hillary Clinton as the United States of America’s next president. In a nutshell, Hillary Clinton is a much worse person than Roman Polanski. So why do these old ladies who speak of Roman Polanski with such venom also want to vote Hillary Clinton into the Oval Office? The whole idea of it all just seems so twisted and unearthly. You as a father would have to realize that Hillary Clinton would never make a suitable president because of her shady background.

  57. Trinity Hall says:

    Hi I’m a teenager and think your all sick why the heck would we want to do such gross things with you?!

    12 really I didn’t even start puberty intill 15 and who the heck wants to have kids kecka young you idiots!!

    >:0. Paedophiles and Ephebophilias!!!!

    • Subliminal Portal says:

      Whoa, wait a minute there, Trinity. Nobody says that you have to do anything with anybody that you don’t want to do. You didn’t start puberty until 15? You must have been small for your size when you were entering middle school. That’s nothing to be ashamed of. The only thing that anyone here on this blog site may be asking of you is to respect others who may not share your opinions. Also, you should not allow yourself to be fooled into believing that a so-called age-appropriate, age-perfect Utopia exists for girls your age. It doesn’t. Anna Duggar of the former TV show named “19 Kids and Counting” had that same illusion wired into her mind when she was a teenager. She married Joshua Duggar, believing that because he fitted the mold of a prima donna prom king who believed in getting married right out of high school to his same-age high school sweetheart, somehow everything in her life was going to be peachy and perfect and would be like a never-ending romance novel. Then she found out the hard way that he wasn’t the goodie-two-shoes that he presented himself to be to her before they got married. Of course, rumor has it that he told her about his lewd transgressions right before he married her, so she played right into his foolishness and destructive behavior if that’s the case.

      Moreover, despite what you may believe, there is a colossal difference between pedophiles and ephebophiles. First of all, a pedophile suffers from a paraphilia and may pose a serious danger to small children. An ephebophile, on the other hand, does not have a paraphilia. He is not much different in his mental wiring than a man over the age of 20 who gravitates to cougars, except that he gravitates to adolescent girls instead of older women for whatever reason. Pedophilia and ephebophilia are worlds apart. “Ephebophile” is more of a label that needlessly distinguishes a young college man who may like a high school girl from a man in his thirties who is married to his same-age sweetheart, whereas “pedophile” is actually an adverse diagnostic term that describes an adult man who is sexually attracted to prepubescent children.

      One movie that appears to debunk the myth that pedophilia and ephebophilia are one and the same is the movie titled “Are All Men Pedophiles?” by Dutch movie producer, Jan Willem-Brure.>>>>Click onto https://youtu.be/2xA9lVaqXpQ
      You may wish to take a look at this same movie before you draw any conclusions on the subject matter.

  58. Leah says:

    Even though the fertility theory makes sense and is very true.. I still think 20 something men dating a 14(or 15) year old is totally sick. AND WHERE ARE THE PARENTS!?😐

    • Subliminal Portal says:

      But here’s the thing, Leah? Considering all the 14, 15, and 16-year-old boys who get adolescent girls (12 to 17 years old) pregnant and then bail on them, somehow I just don’t think that the American culture has that much moral high ground anymore to pass adverse judgment on 20-something-year-old men who date 14 and 15-year-old girls, especially if these men marry these girls later on when they become of age and build lives with them. Let’s face it. The United States of America has become the deadbeat teen dad capital of the world, and it’s only going to get worse with time.

  59. ThongMan. says:

    Where I live is stacks of hot young girls. I love perving on them and why should I feel bad about someone so beautiful. I don’t. Young teen girls have such tight young bodies and their youthfulness gets me so aroused. I know that I would never do anything stupid but just looking in my opinion is fine. I even talk to young girls. What just because I have a conversation with a teen girl does that mean I’m going to force myself on her? God NO. I am always a polite gentleman when talking to girls and just talk to them about general stuff like sports or movies or their work. I love going to the movie cinema Hoyts because theres heaps of beautiful teen girls working there where I can perve and strike up a conversation. They’re always really nice cos I’m just normal. I don’t try too hard and I never say anything inappropriate. I never feel bad about loving teen girls. Older women-fuck no. They’re wrinkly, bossy, nagging, annoying house wives who have baggage from having one too many kids. Who on earth would be attracted to a woman with kids? Most teen girls are virginal, have no kids, are really youthful and are in their prime. Women after 35….yuck. Young girls are sooooo cute and I love their style like their french braided hair…soooooo sexy. And I love when a teen girl bends over in front of you and you can see her brightly coloured g-string hanging out. Booty shorts and leggings are soooo hot also as when a girl wears them in public, I can see her bum cheeks and her shape of her pussy area. Love it when a teen girl shows off her sexy tight midriff and I can see her sexy belly button piercing. Sooooo sexy. In my opinion if girls want to look hot-embrace it as a young girl showing off her tight sexy body to me-is one of the best gifts in the world..wayyy better than drugs. Lol. And it’s perfectly healthy and normal. Thanks girls for putting a smile on my face.

    -Chick lover.

    • Subliminal Portal says:

      ThongMan? Mother Nature is a reality as you describe, but, unfortunately, American society prefers to pretend that life’s main purpose is to please the Puritanical Establishment. In response to your comment about women over 35 years old, I must say that there are a lot of beautiful women over 35 years of age. Look at Brooke Shields, Reese Witherspoon and Drew Barrymore. They’re all three hot women, and they’re all three over 40 years old. Even Christie Brinkley is a knockout, and she’s in her sixties. But here’s the thing. The beautiful women over 35 seldom feel insecure about themselves whenever they see a man their age paying attention to a teenage girl. They just smile and probably think, “Oh, well, I still have the edge over these girls in the area of experience.” It’s the doggy dog women over 35 years old that you described in your post who are always the first to scream “child rapist!” any time they see a man their own age paying attention to a girl who might be even one day shy of her eighteenth birthday. It’s because these same older women are insecure about themselves. If you ever have the chance to see “Nancy Grace” on Headline News, you’ll notice that some of these middle-aged women she has on her show who push for tougher age of consent laws and higher ages of consent are not exactly candidates for Miss Universe. I’m not trying to be shallow. I’m just laying it all out on the table as it is.

  60. Dracht says:

    Wow a post to excuse and encourage pedophilia. I’m sure most men look but don’t touch their daughters. Now discuss graphically. Nice job Emma. Pick better men. I pity you.

    • bella says:

      i agree check out my comment below

    • Subliminal Portal says:

      Now wait a minute, you two. Nobody on this blog sheet has said anything about condoning incest despite what you may believe. Moreover, Emma is not excusing or encouraging pedophilia, but rather she is debunking all of the pseud-intellectual pop psychology that misleads society into mislabeling the wrong people as pedophiles. Read this online article and you will see exactly what I mean.>>>>Click onto https://www.reddit.com/r/confession/comments/1kdu1t/i_am_a_sex_offender_who_is_abused_and_harassed/

      Yeah, I get it. The American culture is not as open-minded about allowing adolescent girls to have boyfriends outside their own age circles as perhaps other cultures may be for whatever reason or another. However, just because a man over 20 years old pays attention to a teenage girl who may even be as young as Bella here, it doesn’t mean that he is going to go out and kidnap, rape, and murder a 5-year-old girl. The Puritanical Establishment appears to brainwash the public into believing in such a misconception, when such nonsense of theirs could not be any further from the truth. It’s called pedophile hysteria, and it has become a major epidemic in the American society. The whole irony of it is that a real pedophile is regularly not even attracted to adolescent girls in the middle school and high school age range. At least not under the criteria that has been outlined in the DSM-V (Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders). A real pedophile preys on small children. Stop letting the press and the media poison your judgment. They don’t care about the truth. They’re just in the business to sell news, real and imagined.

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        Allow me to correct my spelling. On the third and fourth line of my above post, I typed “pseud-intellectual pop psychology.” I meant to type “pseudo-intellectual pop psychology.” Sorry for the confusion.

  61. bella says:

    I am nearly 13, have some curves but am still reasonably average height and quite slim and I was running the other day by myself in the park and a man of about 40 ran up to me and said ‘What would you say if I said I love your body and you?’
    I was scared and grossed out and I don’t think it’s acceptable.

    • Subliminal Portal says:

      Okay, Bella. I see your point. He was a complete stranger, and you have grown up in a culture in which you have been indoctrinated to believe that all men that age are expected to behave with a certain degree of propriety in your presence, so to speak. And, yes, you may have lived a sheltered life up until now; and if that’s the case with you, you’ve got nothing to be ashamed of. However, speaking of what is and is not acceptable, let me just say this. You will find stories all over YouTube and the Internet for that matter of teen mothers who are even as young as you are, and most of them seem to have one thing in common. The father of their baby was some teenage Prince Charming they met at school who quickly bailed on them after they found out they were pregnant. If you don’t like older men showing any kind of extra-Platonic attention towards you, I’m not saying that you have to change anything about the way you feel about it. However, do understand that because of the epidemic of deadbeat teen fathers in our country who are as young as middle school age, there is bound to be adolescent girls who will go straying outside their own age circles looking for romance to get away from these jerks in their own circles. I’m not saying that it may be the best decision those girls make, and, yes, some such relationships can and do become toxic. However, I have known of such girls’ pursuits of older suitors to have happy endings. Take the example of Celine Dion and Rene Angelil. In a nutshell, considering the fact that the United States of America has become the deadbeat teen dad capital of the world, the American culture has lost much of its moral high ground through the years to pass adverse judgment on relationships that adolescent girls may have with older suitors. Don’t change a thing about yourself, but, at the same time, try to keep an open mind.

      • Here says:

        @Subliminal Portal
        – I’m disgusted to know that there are many human being like you who would harm many little children.
        HELL FIRE for eternity may not be enough for you. Stop brainwashing children using celebrity and rich people as example. Celine Dion did it for MONEY and FAME. She wanted to be a pop star. Don’t think that every girls are in the same place as Celine Dion (it’s prostitution of underage girls).
        OLDER MEN should date ADULT WOMEN. end of discussion.

        If they don’t want ADULT and LEGAL person. HELL FIRE have enough place for them.

      • Subliminal Portal says:

        @Here. You’re just another deranged religious fanatic spreading your Puritanical propaganda to anyone who is stupid enough to believe it. Therefore, how can I even take you seriously? If you cannot distinguish the difference between a toddler and an adolescent, then you’ve got some real serious, deep-seated psychological issues. And, no, I have never harmed any children in my life, and you do not have the ability to rewrite history either as you obviously believe you do. Therefore, your accusation against me is completely baseless and a product of your deluded mind. You apparently have not read anything else that I have posted on this blog page; and most everything you say is nothing but a series of both knee-jerk reactions and tantrums that are typical of a narrow-minded Christian fundamentalist as yourself, because you do not back up any of your arguments with any solid facts but rather just your subjective opinions. Nothing you say in your posts is cogent. StJulian does not completely agree with me on this topic, but at least he shows his intelligence by presenting to me what information he has come across on the subject matter. Although I find myself challenging much of the information that he presents to me, I respect his opinion inasmuch as he does not turn our discussions into character assassination wars; whereas you do. Everything with you is your way or the highway as far as you’re concerned. What have you presented in your posts other than hysteria? Despite what you may believe about me, I take a moderate position on this issue. Yeah, I get it. Relationships between adult men and adolescent girls can and have known to be toxic. However, sometimes, and probably more than American society realizes, white is black and black is white. There are also shades of gray. However, you’re probably one of those right-wing hotheads who believes that each and every relationship that has ever existed between an adult man and an adolescent girl from the beginning of time is exploitative and evil, and, at the same time, you believe that teenage boys can do no wrong to adolescent girls of their same age. Well, Mr. Know-It-All (or Ms. Know-It-All, if you’re a woman), chew on this! Look at Philip Chism. He was a 14-year-old boy who brutally raped and murdered a 24-year-old schoolteacher in Massachusetts back in 2013. Do you honestly believe that he would have made a good boyfriend to some 12-or-13-year-old girl back then? If you believe so, then you really have your head buried in the clouds; and I suggest that you don’t breed, because your ignorance will put your own children into danger. Also, don’t be pulling scientific stuff out of your backside either to support your views. You Bible-thumpers are against science and have always been so. Innocent people are being denied good quality medical care nowadays here in the United States, because you Bible-thumpers have made every effort to influence the American government to interfere with embryonic stem cell research. No, I’m not against all Christians. I just don’t like your kind, because you all are pulling this country down with your upside down ways of thinking. Your kind think that it’s perfectly okay that the United States of America has archaic laws on our law books that have caused our nation to have the largest prison system in the world. And, no, Celine Dion did not marry Rene Angelil for money and fame and just to be a pop star. She married him, because she loved him; and when he died, she was grief-stricken. It is not uncommon in the French-speaking culture for an adolescent girl and an adult man to fall in love with each other and eventually marry. When my great-great grandparents got married right before they emigrated from France to the United States of America, my great-great grandmother was 16 years old and my great-great grandfather was 23 years old. Of course, you wouldn’t have known something like that before I told you, because you obviously have never gone outside your own little white picket fence fantasy world where most of your kind dwell. Also, before you try to fool others into believing that you’re this guru of universal wisdom, you might just try to improve your spelling and grammar skills. Your posts were loaded with all sorts of spelling and grammatical errors.

  62. Al says:

    Humans have not evolved like typical animals and therefore seem to have had so many of our biological functions distorted. We for one don’t have a mating season and we follow very selective reproductive habits. A female human must invest nine months to have a single child and furthermore must invest even more time nurturing that child before it can even walk, let alone take care of itself! But what I have seen with humans is a very strange phenomena in which young people may physically be able to bear children, yet mentally they don’t have the capacity to raise the children in our highly sophisticated, rapidly evolving world! It’s as if our brains are evolving faster than our bodies!
    The result is teenagers who are more or less children in grown up or semi grown up bodies. Yet because some young girls are so well developed physically, it is perfectly natural for a man to have a physical attraction to them, however, most mature men understand that they are not adults and therefore would never consider pursuing them because just talking to one will make them realize that they are kids and most men will get turned off by this and get a bit disgusted at the thought of being intimate with someone so young and immature.
    I hope I made myself clear. Again, us humans are the most complicated species on the planet!

    • Subliminal Portal says:

      Al? It all really depends on the situation. Men who were prima donna prom kings all the way back to middle school might think along the same lines the way you describe. That is, they’ve already been down the road of having a relationship with an adolescent girl when they were teenagers themselves and, therefore, they do not wish to revisit the teen dating scene. On the other hand, men who never had an adolescent girlfriend when they were teenage boys themselves may continue to have that one curiosity of what it would be like to romance a girl that age. When men have voids of this nature in their life, nostalgia has a way of creeping up on them when they least expect it.

  63. Here says:

    An adult 18+ attracted to 12 years old girl IS NOT NORMAL. They have a dysfonction in their brain. And it’s not good to use NATURE and SCIENCE for their problem.
    A man have a higher sex drive. So of course he will think about ATTRACTION all the time.
    Those who have brain know the difference between A child and A woman.
    Those who don’t have brain and are attracted to 12 years old are pedophile and predator.

    Don’t get involove with children because Heaven belong to children. And HELL is for all of you. And I’m happy that there is a hell because I’m disgusted by all those satan worshipper. I hope DEMONS will rape you and torture you so maybe it will help your brain to understand life.

  64. Bob Charlie says:

    It’s funny, I happened on this post completely at random…but what’s fun is a study can be done on this comment section over the years. It really demonstrates how a lack of emotional and intellectual intelligence directly correlates with how people react to this blog.

    People with above average intelligence, which you can clearly tell by their writing and reasoning, tend to be more objective when considering the context of the article. Even though it’s a social taboo, discussing pedophilia and sexual attraction to various age groups should be nothing more then an intellectual exercise. After all, this isn’t a child trafficking ring, it’s a blog. Are we not adults enough to discuss these controversial subjects without getting emotional? Lol, apprently not.

    Those whom are clearly below average intelligence tend to have black & white, emotional “fits” that basically descend into name calling and displays of outrage. Because as we’ve all seen over the years, especially on the web, is that stupid people use taboos and virtue signaling to get angry without really having to discuss or dissect a subject in any real detail. Basically because they would be unarmed intellectually – being unable to actually articulate their outrage that isn’t based on any actual logic or understanding. Instead of trying to comprehend our psychology and various human traits, it’s easier to just get upset at anything that sounds unpleasant and goes against social norms. Even discussing these subjects to these dimwits is considered sacrilegious, so it’s better to snuff it out then discuss it with any real candor. And of course, it’s no surprise that the dumbest ones are religious…after all, religion allows stupid people to be lazy with their brains…since they don’t actually have to understand the nature of the world when all the answers are laid before them clear as day – and how convenient that these dummies don’t care about evidence either, otherwise they might struggle with the whole “faith” thing.

    I know I sound condescending, but I honestly do not give a shit. Stupid people continue to act stupid regardless of any argument or point made.

  65. StJulian says:

    You all have made very good points for your arguments. And Bob Charlie, you have made some awesome points which are true. The bottom line is that in our present society young girls are sexualized above and beyond what they were say, 50 years ago? And given all the new morality, men are going to be checking out the young babes, regardless of their age. Some of these young girls are going to be flattered with the attention and they are going to become “women” sooner than later because of it. I make the same argument that I have always made. I, am a retired policeman, and I still take my vow to protect and serve very seriously. When I was an on-the-force COP, I followed the rules, day in and day out. I often got the evil eye from some of my brothers in blue because I didn’t “front” for any cop who participated in corrupt or unbecoming behavior. It’s no fun being on a force where they dislike you for doing your job well and never breaking the rules. They label you Dudley Do Right, and some other less favorable names. However, from a law enforcement standpoint, preteens, young teens, and any girl under the age of 16-18, depending on the state, are legally off limits to grownup men. This, is the law of the land that I swore to uphold. I may not always agree with it, but I will always enforce it if I need to. So call me below average in intelligence if you like. It doesn’t matter if a study had been done and the evidence is overwhelming, if the law says “no touchy-touchy,” then I have a pair of handcuffs for the guy that I catch breaking that law.

  66. Anonymous says:

    Hebephilia is normal.

  67. Bill Purdy says:

    I would say that a possible evolutionary reason for a lot of male attraction to young girls, as evidenced by waves of arrests daily over crimes involving this, was to keep young female prehistoric children alive until they were fertile. An ancient man probably needed motivation to feed, shelter, and protect a young female, who would otherwise just be consuming some of the food supply he needed for himself. Parents of children probably died relatively young, leaving a lot of 11 and 12 year old girls wandering around with noone to feed or shelter them or protect them from the wild. The attraction to a girl before fertility could just be nature’s carrot for a man to swoop in and care for her until she was fertile – it sounds ugly to the modern civilized human; and it WOULD be ugly for a modern civilized human to steal a childhood like that; but, frankly, evolution doesn’t give a fuck about your or my moral standards – survival is the name of the game, or was at one time. On a related note, homosexuality may exist for an evolutionary reason so there were men to care for childless young boys, as well. I know this all sounds positively sick (I’m making myself sick as I type this), but you have to remember that we evolved as wild animals – we still are wild animals deep insde – due to our big brains and capacty for thinking and philosophizing, we have simply developed moral codes in modern society that keep us from acting like savage animals, especially since there’s no longer a survival need to do that. We know it’s wrong to steal childhood innocence to momentarily satisfy a deeply buried animal craving, so it gets suppressed usually (thank god). Deep down, that animal still lives, though, which explains the waves of arrests on a daily basis. I haven’t read this hypothesis anywhere – it’s just something that I’ve thought about from time to time. It may or may not be original – it’s not the type of hypothesis I want to be googling about to see if anyone else thought of it. 🙂 haha

  68. Mature Age Bachelor says:

    Gordon wrote: “Melanie, are you aware that Mary had Jesus when she was between 12-15 years old? And even for non-immaculate conception, this was considered NORMAL in biblical times? I wonder if you really have the moral standing to tell others that they should or should not be allowed to live…” I agree with you Gordon. I have also studied the Scriptures, and found that consensual heterosexual relationships between grown men and young teen girls was normal in Bible times, and was not considered a sin ( except in cases of incest ). Melanie is just a “moral” busybody who is promoting a standard which goes beyond God’s Laws. Human opinion does NOT establish morality. God’s Laws are the only legitimate means we have of establishing morality. If God does not prohibit it, then it is not sin.

    • Tina says:

      The comments here are really something. Yes, in today’s society is it deviant to find 12-year old girls sexually attractive if you’re an adult. It’s illegal to act on those desires, unless a man wants to be in jail.

      Mary’s age when she had Jesus is a moot point, because she never had sex. Back in those days, the lifespan was significantly shorter on average, and it made sense to get married at younger ages and have children. If you’ll likely die by age 30 or 35, it makes sense to be married and have children at age 16. Just because something isn’t a sin, doesn’t mean it’s right.

      When I started reading this article and the comments, I wanted to give it the benefit of the doubt. I didn’t have to scroll halfway down to see that there are some wacked up views. I have a lot of issues with feminism, but reading some of these comments makes me think about why feminist blogs linked “rape culture” (whatever that is) to the sexual tweets from men over Valentina Schulz.

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