Angry Friendzoned Guys and Angry Sexzoned Girls

Here's a 15 year old me, chilling near a cool Russian monument

Here’s a 15 year old me, chilling near a cool Russian monument

If a guy says something angry upon being friendzoned, he is usually judged harshly, and it’s suggested he felt entitled to sex to have this attitude. And sometimes they say he thought that a woman’s friendship was a consolation prize (which is an insult to her friendship).

A woman is not a machine where you insert friendship coins, until sex falls out!..

Indeed it’s true. But isn’t the same true for men?

A man is not a machine where you insert friendship coins, until friendship falls out.

Offering friendship does not necessarily result in friendship. Sometimes people aren’t interested, or want more. Does that mean women who become angry when friendship is refused, felt entitled to a man’s friendship? Ian Ironwood suggests so: http://theredpillroom.blogspot.no/2014/10/breaking-beta-ending-female-social.html . I think entitlement feelings about sex or friendship might happen, but it’s not necessary to explain the friendzone situation.

When I was a teenager, I moved to another country. I thus lost all my friends, and could only call them rarely. I had to learn to speak English and then Norwegian. I was also naturally introverted and kind of socially awkward at the time. I made my best to fit in and get to know people, but getting true friends was very difficult. I was very lonely. I saw that effort made no difference and started to get kind of mean. At this time, various older guys started hitting on me. Since I had no one to really hang out with, I tried to be “friends” with them. But they only wanted sex, which I didn’t want and was too young for. It was very frustrating and since they gave me nothing, I also gave very little. If they took me out for dinner, I took the dinner. Made out with a few of them, but backed out of having sex every time, unintentionally being a cocktease. I knew they wanted more than I could give, but I tried being friends anyway, as that desire overrode concern for their feelings. If they wouldn’t give it to me, I’d at least take their stuff (that which was freely given, obviously).

I regret being mean to them, but I also can’t judge myself too harshly. Since then I learned the truth in the saying “It’s better to be alone, than with just anybody”. And I realize it’s bad to string along unsuspecting men, just because their refusal to be friends hurt me and deprived me of what I need. But I was young and friendless, and it’s hard to imagine how I could have done better.

This experience makes me wonder if this is how it feels for a young guy to be sexless or girlfriendless?.. Some need is not being met, the efforts he’s making aren’t making a dent, and the incentive to be nice is disappearing. And just like offers of sex felt demanding and using to me, perhaps offers of friendship feel using to him.

I’m not saying it’s good to react that way. Like I said, I regret it. But it’s hardly an entitled reaction (I just WANTED friends pretty badly, not felt entitled to them), and is understandable in some ways, especially if the person is young, or/and doesn’t understand why the other person doesn’t want their sex/friendship. The negatively charged friendzone situation could simply be about two people who don’t understand how the opposite sex thinks. The guy might think “She doesn’t want to have sex with me even though I did everything right, but she wants sex with that guy who does everything wrong. Liar”. The girl might think “He puts no value in my friendship. He only valued me for my body. Pig”. Yet if they only knew how the other person thinks, they would not be so angry. And it’s possible to treat someone well, even if they have nothing to offer or offer only expenses. You don’t have to say yes to them.

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18 Responses to Angry Friendzoned Guys and Angry Sexzoned Girls

  1. b g says:

    True that. Men at least know that they do not understand women, but many, possibly most, women seem to think that they know everything about men ;-D

  2. Eric says:

    “This made me wonder if this is what it feels for a young guy to be sexless/girlfriendless? Some need is not being met and the efforts he’s making aren’t making a dent, and the incentive to be nice is disappearing. And just like offers of sex felt demanding to me, maybe offers of friendship felt demanding to him.”

    YES this is how it feels. This isn’t to say that men don’t want female friends outside of sexual reasons; but most initiate friendship with the potential of sex in mind.

    • emmatheemo says:

      Heh, well there is a saying, that goes something like “A man and a woman can be friends, but only after they’ve been lovers”. It seems to correspond to many men’s view of it. Although I also think a cad/player can have female friends, since he feels no pressure to have sex with them, especially if they are plain.

  3. Liz says:

    OT but…are you from Russia originally, Emma? I didn’t know you emigrated to Sweden from somewhere else. So you speak at least three languages?

    I friendzoned my fair share of guys in my youth, but I never took advantage of them, from my perspective (I didn’t lead them on or have them buy me things). My husband and I were friends at first, but I never friendzoned him.

    • emmatheemo says:

      Actually I’m in Norway 🙂 And yes, I’m from Russia. I came to Norway when I was 12-13. I do speak three languages, but that is almost automatic for a foreigner here.

      It’s nice that you didn’t treat your friendzoned guys badly. How did you deal with them? How did they react? I’m just curious 🙂

      • Liz says:

        “How did you deal with them? How did they react? I’m just curious”
        Hm.
        Well, we only went out in groups, not ‘dates’, and I always paid my own way. I didn’t give them any signals that I wanted anything ‘more’. There was one guy I wanted to like (in a romantic way), and I liked him as a friend very much.
        We did date a couple of times (I always paid). Kissed a little, but nothing more. I know he was in love with me for years, but he just didn’t ‘do it’ for me. We kept in touch for a while and then he got engaged to someone I never met, and went his own way.
        He wrote to me a few years later and my mom got the note and opened it and read it. She didn’t understand the jokes and thought he must’ve been drunk or high. I’d been married for a while and living away by then (think I was in South Korea)…I got the letter more than a year after it arrived at my mom’s house. I didn’t respond because so much time had passed, but I probably should have. He’s a physician now, he was applying to medical school way back then. He was a really brilliant guy (though my husband is more brilliant).

  4. Hi Emma. Linked your post here.

  5. This is where I split with a lot of the “red pill” and “manosphere” guys, because there is still this idea that a) men want sex more than relationships and b) women want relationships more than sex.

    Guys can be “sex zoned” (*raises hand* – they call us “bad boys”) and women can be “friend zoned” (we call it “saving her for marriage.”)

    But, yes, women do get “sex zoned.”

    • emmatheemo says:

      I can believe women sexzoning some guys, at least to begin with (like the latest advice offered by Sheryl Sandberg). But what if one of those bad boys suddenly offers her commitment? Would she say no?

      Also, why would men save certain women for marriage? Is it simply a practical thing? If he starts having sex with her and women who he doesn’t want to commit to, he might lose her. But if she was guaranteed to stay in this harem until he dropped all the others and married her, would he really say no to premarital sex with her? 🙂 Just curious.

      • women who he doesn’t want to commit to

        “Commit?” What does that mean, exactly?

        dropped all the others and married her

        LOL – this is like the start of a bodice-ripper.

        Then, the Wealthy Hot CEO with his own private airplane said, “oh, you are the most interesting woman I ever met – because of you all about that bass” bootey” something!

        Click here to read more …

      • emmatheemo says:

        Women he doesn’t want to commit to are those he is not “saving for marriage”.

    • Liz says:

      “I love you and respect you too much to have sex with you, my little dumpling. Will you marry me?”

      Sounds like the opposite of a bodice ripper.

      • Liz says:

        Caveat, I’d say it’s a bit different if both are saving themselves, but if the guy is bedhopping and doesn’t have the desire to have sex with his chosen woman that’s a recipe for passionless marriage. It would suck to be married to a person you don’t desire.

  6. Uncalledfor says:

    Since you used the e-word

    I think entitlement feelings about sex or friendship might happen

    I get to ask you: how do you know when the word “entitled” is correct to apply, to someone’s feelings or attitude? It gets thrown around quite a bit, but after thinking about it I’ve really come to the conclusion that it’s mostly just shaming language and ultimately meaningless.

    Here’s another way to put it:

    1. If a person says/writes explicitly, “I am entitled to X” or “I feel I’m entitled to X”, then there’s no argument that the person has entitled feelings/attitude.

    2. If a person does _not_ use the word “entitled” to describe him/herself, then how and when, exactly, are you entitled (as it were) to apply that word? Can you do better here than resorting to the word “seems”, as in “he seems to feel entitled” or “it just seems that way to me”? Is there a definite, objective, logical criterion for when/where this should apply?

    3. Is there a difference between “entitled” and “deserve”? I’d be interested in the view of a non-native speaker/writer of English. They’re almost synonyms in daily use, but can also diverge wildly: nearly everyone seems to agree that “no one is entitled to sex”; but saying “no one deserves sex” sounds just crazy to me.

    I think this question is right up your alley to think about; thanks.

    • emmatheemo says:

      That’s an interesting question. On the first glance, I mostly agree with you. It’s hard to tell when someone is feeling entitled.

      If a woman calls a man “gay” for rejecting her in a club, is she feeling entitled to his attention? Perhaps not – she is simply reacting like a jerk when her expectations has been violated by this guy, probably feels a bit humiliated, and is trying to regain her social status or ego. She should get thicker skin and take it in stride when it happens, but it doesn’t mean she felt entitled.

      If a rapist rapes a woman, did he feel entitled to sex with her? I don’t know. Perhaps he didn’t feel like he’s owed sex at all, but he simply doesn’t mind using force to get it. Same for thieves who steal and muggers who rob.

      The only time it’s clear to me that someone’s feeling entitled, is when they lack something, say they are owed it/have a right to it, and demand the government give it to them. It can be correct, if it’s something like the right to freedom of speech (I feel entitled to that). But it can also be bad, like when someone feels they have a right to someone else’s stuff. That leads me to conclude that politics are full of entitled-feeling people, and are actively encouraging entitlement 🙂

      I also agree with you on “deserve”. I don’t think it has the same meaning. To be entitled is to have a right. To deserve is to be worthy of something. But not everyone who deserves, gets. Such is life. If someone’s rights (entitlements) are violated, it’s usually a big deal and might be a serious problem with the government. But if someone doesn’t get what they deserve, it’s more like a personal tragedy – we might cry with them, but it’s not a problem the government needs to fix.

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